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Yvonne Martin

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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  duncanmac on Thu 13 Oct - 18:46

Wasnt it Yvonne Martin who asked
' What have you done with your daughter, Mrs McCann ? "

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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  mumbles on Thu 13 Oct - 18:53

duncanmac wrote:Wasnt it Yvonne Martin who asked
' What have you done with your daughter, Mrs McCann ? "

I may be wrong... but I'm sure it was one of the British police officers that was assigned to the family in Portugal.

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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  Badboy on Thu 13 Oct - 18:53

duncanmac wrote:Wasnt it Yvonne Martin who asked
' What have you done with your daughter, Mrs McCann ? "
WASN'T THAT THE FAMILY LIASION OFFICER THAT SAID THAT?

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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  platinum on Thu 13 Oct - 19:56

Badboy wrote:
gillyspot wrote:fred I agree with you there.

I find it interesting that Kate says this

"David was standing nearby. Concerned he took me aside and pointed out that we didnít know who this woman was or what she was doing there. He reassured me that I wasnít obliged to speak to her if I didnít want to. And I didnít want to. Whoever she was, and whatever her credential were, it was an inappropriate intrusion. And something about it, something about her, just didnít feel right. I was glad I extricated myself. This woman would pop up several times in the days and months to come and I still donít really know who she is or what she was trying to achieve."

David Payne (he of the Gaspar Statement) makes a point of telling Kate that she doesn't need to speak to Yvonne Martin. I wonder why.
SURELY SHE HAS READ THE PJ FILES,SO WOULD KNOW WHO SHE IS,ALTERNATIVELY ITS ONLY AN INTERNET SEARCH AWAY.

I'm not sure I am right here but that bit above is about her not knowing who Yvonne Martin was at the time in PDL. She couldn't have read any files then.

But I agree with those who think its very strange if Kate says in her book that she doesn't know who Yvonne Martin is.

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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  mumbles on Thu 13 Oct - 20:05

Badboy wrote:
duncanmac wrote:Wasnt it Yvonne Martin who asked
' What have you done with your daughter, Mrs McCann ? "
WASN'T THAT THE FAMILY LIASION OFFICER THAT SAID THAT?

Snap!

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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  Bobsy on Thu 13 Oct - 20:10

Good evening folks. YM was a long service social worker and would be very well used to reactions from parents but I get the feeling she was worried about DP and his connection with the parents of a missing child.
In all honesty had I been in the same situation of thinking my child had been abducted I would have welcomed the help of a person of such experience and not been swayed by my ear being bent to turn said person away.

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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  mumbles on Thu 13 Oct - 20:19

Bobsy wrote:Good evening folks. YM was a long service social worker and would be very well used to reactions from parents but I get the feeling she was worried about DP and his connection with the parents of a missing child.
In all honesty had I been in the same situation of thinking my child had been abducted I would have welcomed the help of a person of such experience and not been swayed by my ear being bent to turn said person away.

Well exactly Bobsy... but when have the McCanns done anything the way most people would if they found themselves in the same situation!!

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A couple?

Post  NoStone on Fri 14 Oct - 8:43

The statement that Kate made to Yvonne - that a couple had abducted Madeleine has made me think. It would of course fit with Kate's prounouncement 'THEY have taken her'

I wonder if the original abduction scenario the McC's had come up with was that Madeleine had been abducted by a childless couple in which case things would not be so bad as the girl would be well looked after in these circumstances you would think.

The trouble the McC's have with this scenario of course is that someone would have to witness a couple taking Madeleine. They could not witness that themselves as they would have gone running after the 'abductors'. The hope would be that other witnesses would come forward seeing a couple with a child (which happened did'nt it with the couple at the garage - amazingly). With JT's 'evidence' of a sole male 'abductor' the McC's were not able to promote the 'couple' idea any further and had to drop it.


So do these referefnce indicate a change from the original story they tried to weave????

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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  malena stool on Fri 14 Oct - 12:05

What is shown here is no more than the disparity between the Police Files, (gathered evidence in statement form, forensics and canine all factual and unbiased) and a story book published by one of the suspect couple....
I know just which version I believe regardless of the mass hysteria storm drummed up by the media and propaganda barons such as Mitchell.

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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  gillyspot on Fri 14 Oct - 12:22

Still gets me cross that "Madeleine" by Kate McCann is in the NON FICTION section in bookshops. Why she called it Madeleine is another mystery - it is all about Queen Kate and her rantings.

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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  HiDeHo on Fri 14 Oct - 15:13

I have always believed that the 'discovery' was preplanned and that Kate was acting out her scene.

Given that scenario, that Kate went to the apartment knowing that she was to claim an abductors had taken Madeleine, she returned with the comments accordingly 'They have taken her'....forgetting that not everyone was in on the plan and would not know who she meant by 'they' and 'her'.

She was overly familiar with the plan and should have said 'Someone's taken Madeleine'

This is explained better by a 3A member that first came up with this, but I can't remember who.

It may have been at that point, when asked by the police that night, who 'they' were, that she decided to claim it was a couple to cover her mistake....rather than the 'abductor', that was the planned 'they'.


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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  AnnaEsse on Fri 14 Oct - 17:21

HiDeHo wrote:I have always believed that the 'discovery' was preplanned and that Kate was acting out her scene.

Given that scenario, that Kate went to the apartment knowing that she was to claim an abductors had taken Madeleine, she returned with the comments accordingly 'They have taken her'....forgetting that not everyone was in on the plan and would not know who she meant by 'they' and 'her'.

She was overly familiar with the plan and should have said 'Someone's taken Madeleine'

This is explained better by a 3A member that first came up with this, but I can't remember who.

It may have been at that point, when asked by the police that night, who 'they' were, that she decided to claim it was a couple to cover her mistake....rather than the 'abductor', that was the planned 'they'.


It may have been me because I have described that scenario before a few times. Imagine Gerry planning the process.

Right, when I go, I'll make sure the shutters look like there's been a break in. It has to look like someone has jemmied the shutters, broken in and taken Madeleine. Then you have to find Madeleine gone and raise the alarm that they've taken her.

So, that's what Kate has in her mind. Gerry damages the shutters, an abductor has taken Madeleine and Kate has to say that they've taken her.

_________________________________________________________________________________________________
"You can run on for a long time, Run on for a long time, Run on for a long time, Sooner or later God'll cut you down." (Johnny Cash)

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Better title.

Post  tigger on Fri 14 Oct - 18:31

gillyspot wrote:Still gets me cross that "Madeleine" by Kate McCann is in the NON FICTION section in bookshops. Why she called it Madeleine is another mystery - it is all about Queen Kate and her rantings.

I like to think of it as "Mein Kampf" - describes the content much better I think..

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First plan and first abductors

Post  tigger on Fri 14 Oct - 18:41

HiDeHo wrote:I have always believed that the 'discovery' was preplanned and that Kate was acting out her scene.

Given that scenario, that Kate went to the apartment knowing that she was to claim an abductors had taken Madeleine, she returned with the comments accordingly 'They have taken her'....forgetting that not everyone was in on the plan and would not know who she meant by 'they' and 'her'.

She was overly familiar with the plan and should have said 'Someone's taken Madeleine'

This is explained better by a 3A member that first came up with this, but I can't remember who.

It may have been at that point, when asked by the police that night, who 'they' were, that she decided to claim it was a couple to cover her mistake....rather than the 'abductor', that was the planned 'they'.



The idea of a couple taking Maddie sort of fits with a lot of things Kate kept saying even when the abductors had changed to badly dressed paedophiles: e.g.
I hope that whoever got her will be looking after her. - She will light up the lives of whoever she it with etc. All totally bananas when matched with the TM official story.

Re Yvonne Martin, Kate's reaction was that of a guilty person. A truly distraught mother, on hearing that an expert on child welfare had arrived on her doorstep, would have clung to her like a drowning woman. An English woman to boot, amongst all the non expert Portugese around her.
No manna from heaven for Kate, she couldn't get rid of her fast enough.
Imo Kate was distressed because the whole thing had gone really badly, the shutters were a wash out, the timeline barely worked, Gerry's masonic ritual hadn't worked and so on.
I think she was frighened that they'd already been rumbled.

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A question

Post  NoStone on Fri 14 Oct - 19:02

So when Kate told Yvonne - a couple took Madeleine - did Yvonne ask who the couple was? - or how Kate knew it was a couple that took the girl? It would be a pretty fundamental question to ask at that point in the proceedings!

A girl has gone missing - the mother says a couple took her and a qualified social worker does not ask who or how the mother knew? It would be good to ask Yvonne if she did ask the question and what the response was, why that information did not find its way into the PJ files - or - if she did not ask the question - why she thought it not significant enough to ask given a little girl had been 'abducted'!??

Top and bottom of it is that this case needs re-opening, either here or in Portugal and these questions answered. The Priest interviewed too! And those responsible for the fate of the little girl - locked behind bars where they belong.


Last edited by NoStone on Fri 14 Oct - 19:04; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : spelling!! again... I must spell better I must smell better)

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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  HiDeHo on Fri 14 Oct - 23:20

We know that there are statements taken and referred to but do not appear in the files (eg Carolyn Carpenter)

Goncalo Amaral refers to comments from the cleaner about the shutters being cleaned on Wednesday, so I see no reason why there are not several other statements that have not been disclosed (Irwins?)

What has been released is not enough to convict the McCanns but what they 'hold', including text messages etc and further comments from Yvonne Martin, may be the details the McCanns want their hands on

Thanks Anna Esse. You may recall me asking someone (you) once before. I feel that is an important and logical reason for that comment and will keep it in my belief bucket.

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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  malena stool on Sat 15 Oct - 21:22

HiDeHo wrote:We know that there are statements taken and referred to but do not appear in the files (eg Carolyn Carpenter)

Goncalo Amaral refers to comments from the cleaner about the shutters being cleaned on Wednesday, so I see no reason why there are not several other statements that have not been disclosed (Irwins?)

What has been released is not enough to convict the McCanns but what they 'hold', including text messages etc and further comments from Yvonne Martin, may be the details the McCanns want their hands on

Thanks Anna Esse. You may recall me asking someone (you) once before. I feel that is an important and logical reason for that comment and will keep it in my belief bucket.
I've always believed that it is the statements and who made them and not released that the McCanns are frightened of and why they have plagued and pestered Cameron, May and Lord knows who else to have the files turned over for them to scrutinise and concoct a defence for their actions.
I read somewhere (can't find the quote) that Amaral himself stated there are facts of Madeleine's disappearance which have not yet been released.

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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  Maggie on Sat 15 Oct - 22:11



Does anyone knnow if Yvonne Martiin is still working in child protection. The reason I ask is, I worked for the same authority that she worked for and have asked people I worked with if they knew her, so far no luck.

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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  HiDeHo on Sun 16 Oct - 5:35

malena stool wrote:
HiDeHo wrote:We know that there are statements taken and referred to but do not appear in the files (eg Carolyn Carpenter)

Goncalo Amaral refers to comments from the cleaner about the shutters being cleaned on Wednesday, so I see no reason why there are not several other statements that have not been disclosed (Irwins?)

What has been released is not enough to convict the McCanns but what they 'hold', including text messages etc and further comments from Yvonne Martin, may be the details the McCanns want their hands on

Thanks Anna Esse. You may recall me asking someone (you) once before. I feel that is an important and logical reason for that comment and will keep it in my belief bucket.
I've always believed that it is the statements and who made them and not released that the McCanns are frightened of and why they have plagued and pestered Cameron, May and Lord knows who else to have the files turned over for them to scrutinise and concoct a defence for their actions.
I read somewhere (can't find the quote) that Amaral himself stated there are facts of Madeleine's disappearance which have not yet been released.

Goncalo discusses about the contents of the text messages in one of his interviews as well as this....


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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  Guest on Sun 16 Oct - 8:04

AnnaEsse wrote:
chrissie wrote:I agree Anna and Yvonne also had proof of her position. I would have thought they would have welcomed some help from an English speaking professional (I am in no way suggesting that PT residents cannot speak English btw )

Especially someone who made an effort to show that she was qualified in Child Protection and showed her CRB document, which I would have thought might have engendered confidence and a guarantee of confidentiality.

And expecially if your child has just been "abducted by a paedophile gang".

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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  Loopdaloop on Sun 16 Oct - 18:04

gillyspot wrote:Yvonne Martin as she appears in Kate McCann's book

""A middle-aged British woman lady suddenly materialized beside me and introduced herself. She announced that she was, or had been, a social worker or child protection officer and insisted on showing me her professional papers, including, I think, her Criminal Records Bureau certificate. She asked me to sit down on a low wall, plonked herself next to me and told me she wanted me to go through everything that had happened the previous night. She was quite pushy and her manner, her very presence, were making me feel uncomfortable and adding to my distress.

David was standing nearby. Concerned he took me aside and pointed out that we didnít know who this woman was or what she was doing there. He reassured me that I wasnít obliged to speak to her if I didnít want to. And I didnít want to. Whoever she was, and whatever her credential were, it was an inappropriate intrusion. And something about it, something about her, just didnít feel right. I was glad I extricated myself. This woman would pop up several times in the days and months to come and I still donít really know who she is or what she was trying to achieve."

For her to be written about detrimentally 'materialising' in the book then there must be something more to it. I would have thought they would have been happy to have someone with her expertise offering help. I mean, they attempted to solicit help everywhere else... Yet not Yvonne who took the time out to try and find them to help...

I still believe that she did know exactly where she saw DP.

Bebootje wrote:Otherwise, when I had a child lost in a foreign country I would be happy with any official/certified help I could get certainly from a fellow Brit.
But I can imagine that they wanted help from a social worker. Cause they were indeed negligent.

agreed!

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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  Loopdaloop on Sun 16 Oct - 18:09

Autumn wrote:

Exactly AnnaEsse, a reason for Kate's book was to discredit key figures such as Mrs Fenn and Yvonne Martin. I haven't read it but wonder if there is anyone else in it that she has attempted to discredit and put in a bad light.

I'm actually going to go to the library and rent this book now as I'm intrigued too. For details such as this as well as the easter eggs they've left to explain away future suspicion.

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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  Loopdaloop on Sun 16 Oct - 18:13

NoStone wrote:The statement that Kate made to Yvonne - that a couple had abducted Madeleine has made me think. It would of course fit with Kate's prounouncement 'THEY have taken her'

I wonder if the original abduction scenario the McC's had come up with was that Madeleine had been abducted by a childless couple in which case things would not be so bad as the girl would be well looked after in these circumstances you would think.

The trouble the McC's have with this scenario of course is that someone would have to witness a couple taking Madeleine. They could not witness that themselves as they would have gone running after the 'abductors'. The hope would be that other witnesses would come forward seeing a couple with a child (which happened did'nt it with the couple at the garage - amazingly). With JT's 'evidence' of a sole male 'abductor' the McC's were not able to promote the 'couple' idea any further and had to drop it.


So do these referefnce indicate a change from the original story they tried to weave????

JT Saw Gerry disposing of the body did she not! But I agree with your logic... the initial scenario of a 'childless couple' would allow them to settle down with their lives much quicker!

Missing pages

A - In the inquiry there are passages that contain information that can contend with the right to private life of people, not only British citizens, for whom there was found not the faintest hint of implication in this case, namely:

Volume I, fls. 211/212: reference to an individual with a past linked to crimes of a sexual nature with children.

Volume II
- Fls. 293/297: is a list of individuals connected with the practice of sex crimes with minors and adolescents.
- Fls. 298/300: reference to an individual linked with the practice of acts of pedophilia and exhibitionism;
- Fls. 473/474: reference to an individual linked with the practice of acts of exhibitionism.

Volume III, fls. 754/757: information and bibliographic record of a citizen in connection with acts of paedophilia.
taken from: http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MISSING_PAGES.htm

Was details of david payne that Ms Martin supplied in volume 1 or 3 I wonder.

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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  Lillyofthevalley on Sun 16 Oct - 18:26

gillyspot wrote:Yvonne Martin as she appears in Kate McCann's book

""A middle-aged British woman lady suddenly materialized beside me and introduced herself. She announced that she was, or had been, a social worker or child protection officer and insisted on showing me her professional papers, including, I think, her Criminal Records Bureau certificate. She asked me to sit down on a low wall, plonked herself next to me and told me she wanted me to go through everything that had happened the previous night. She was quite pushy and her manner, her very presence, were making me feel uncomfortable and adding to my distress.

David was standing nearby. Concerned he took me aside and pointed out that we didnít know who this woman was or what she was doing there. He reassured me that I wasnít obliged to speak to her if I didnít want to. And I didnít want to. Whoever she was, and whatever her credential were, it was an inappropriate intrusion. And something about it, something about her, just didnít feel right. I was glad I extricated myself. This woman would pop up several times in the days and months to come and I still donít really know who she is or what she was trying to achieve."

Its a real shame that Ms Martin dosen't feel the need to counteract or speak out about what Kate says in her Bewk about her, I would if I was Yvonne Martin, another person like lots of others who have for some reason never felt the need to speak out to clear there name dragged in to the mud by the Mcs, very strange indeed, unless they have been told something that is happily making them stay quiet!!!!!!

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Re: Yvonne Martin

Post  Lillyofthevalley on Sun 16 Oct - 18:42

Bobsy wrote:Good evening folks. YM was a long service social worker and would be very well used to reactions from parents but I get the feeling she was worried about DP and his connection with the parents of a missing child.
In all honesty had I been in the same situation of thinking my child had been abducted I would have welcomed the help of a person of such experience and not been swayed by my ear being bent to turn said person away.

Bobsy me too! My life would be in melt down and I would listen to anyone who was in the YM profession, its totaly unbelievable that you would not want the help of a specialised social worker when your child had been abducted, or would you want someone like this around you if your daughter hadn't and she had disappeared under other very serious circumstances, imo thats the only reason for Kates reaction, the same as anyone else who dare question the Mcs that they didn't like.

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Re: Yvonne Martin

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