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Today's Conclusions!

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Today's Conclusions!

Post  NoStone on Wed 23 Nov - 19:02

I have not seen any of today's 'performance' by the McC's and only caught a couple of sound bites on the radio on the way home - quick flick through the boards etc.

So far I am left with the impression that today has not been the wonderful platform that they might have wished for but then I need to see the whole thing.

But what I thought I heard on the radio was that Lord Levison had said there may well be a further investigation into how the diary got into the hands of the NOW!! Was this the point when Gerry started to cry?

Is this a fact? If so i bet the Mc's and Clarry are -ing it as I have my doubts that the 'leak' came from a 'Portugese Reporter' who was sickened by the treatment the Mc's had had!!!

What's your overall take on the days events?

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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  pennylane on Wed 23 Nov - 19:05

My overall take is that Lord Levison kissed their lying backsides.

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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  AnnaEsse on Wed 23 Nov - 19:06

My conclusion is that the McCanns appeared to show more distress then they ever did over their daughter's disappearance. A very good performance.

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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  marxman on Wed 23 Nov - 19:24

My conclusion is that someone should inform Gerry that his
missing daughter is called Madeleine and NOT Madel-line!!
He corrected himself though but what a gaff!

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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  Bobsy on Wed 23 Nov - 19:26

Hubby and I sat and watched from start to finish and hubby was forbidden to make a sound. I feel they were treated as being very special, offered breaks, yuk, no for me as I have already said it is the first official coat of whitewash. And I was fed up of hearing the Portuguese police being hinted at as being corrupt.
My only hope now is GA and PB.

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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  whatsupdoc on Wed 23 Nov - 19:31

pennylane wrote:My overall take is that Lord Levison kissed their lying backsides.

Agreed. Gerry knew he would have an easy ride . He is protected by his masonic brothers. I just hope justice will come in Portugal where things may well be different and hopefully we all may see a result.

Lord Justice Leveson made the mistake of using the word "Abducted" instead of disappeared. He should know that he shouldn't assume that Madeleine was abducted. He only has the word of the two chief suspects in the case. I found it a disgusting spectacle of brown-nosing. I feared that the rest of the proceeding would be somewhat of a waste of time but watched most of the performance.

Why do none of the press and tv acknowledge the findings of the Portuguese Police who quickly discounted the abduction theory claimed by the McCann's?




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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  margaret on Wed 23 Nov - 19:32

pennylane wrote:My overall take is that Lord Levison kissed their lying backsides.

Agreed. It was pathetic watching them go over each and every headline and claim it was lies.

YOU prove Madel-line isn't dead then.
YOU prove she was abducted.
YOU prove none of Maddies DNA wasn't found

etc, etc, they CAN'T prove their innocence either so how come they're allowed to state all of these were lies?

I hope the press goes to town with some of the stories they've been holding back about them now.

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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  pennylane on Wed 23 Nov - 20:00

Anyone recall when Gerry commented that a Taxi driver in Holland said to them 'your the ones who killed your daughter, what did you do with the body?' (paraphrasing). Gerry admitted that in other countries people believe they are guilty, and this (he said) hurt the search. An indirect snipe at Dr Amaral I thought!

Light bulb Gerry, the reason they think you are guilty on the continent is because they believe the Portuguese Police over you and your child neglecting wife, and any half wit can see Jane Tanner's abductor sighting is as ridiculous as your pathetic version of events!

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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  pennylane on Wed 23 Nov - 20:16

whatsupdoc wrote:
pennylane wrote:My overall take is that Lord Levison kissed their lying backsides.

Agreed. Gerry knew he would have an easy ride . He is protected by his masonic brothers. I just hope justice will come in Portugal where things may well be different and hopefully we all may see a result.

Lord Justice Leveson made the mistake of using the word "Abducted" instead of disappeared. He should know that he shouldn't assume that Madeleine was abducted. He only has the word of the two chief suspects in the case. I found it a disgusting spectacle of brown-nosing. I feared that the rest of the proceeding would be somewhat of a waste of time but watched most of the performance.

Why do none of the press and tv acknowledge the findings of the Portuguese Police who quickly discounted the abduction theory claimed by the McCann's?




Hi doc,

Not only Leveson but the person questioning them used the word 'abducted' also, and so did Sky News today. As I said earlier today.... the word 'disappeared' has now disappeared too.

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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  kitti on Wed 23 Nov - 20:25

My conclusion....the same as it was before ....



3 things.....

1. Pj bashing.

2. Portuguese press bashing.


3. DNA bashing...


Don't blame the British press....they copied from the portuguese press.


The pj leaked information to the press..(Gerry today says they werent hacked so...open ended answer )

Their was NO DNA off madeleines in car.....hello....didn't the mccanns say that OFF COURSE there was DNA off madeleines In the car as Amalie wore her clothes and shoes....!!!!!

This enquiry off the mccanns was to highlight that....no corpse in the car.....no frozen corpse....no blood in the apt....Madeleine is alive ....

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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  kitti on Wed 23 Nov - 20:33

The man behind Levison..... 'we don't need to show the article relating to....Madeleine was sold because the mccanns were hard up'.....ok that was a ridiculous article but what about...'Gerry McCann was not madeleines fAther' or...'Madeleine father is exonerated who lives in birmingham'....now those articles would off really upset me but no..not mentioned.

It was about...'frozen corpes'. Kate McCann....it was all about ..dissing the dogs without mentioning them...the DNA..blood etc was A LIE?

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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  NoStone on Wed 23 Nov - 20:42

Robert Jake QC:- 'Yes - You say in your statement para 15 in the initial stages - your engagement with the press worked well - are you able to amplify that a little bit for us please?'

Gerry: ' I think for those people that can remember it was a very unusual scenario and we got a distinct impression that there was a genuine want to help er attitude from the journalists there and I think from many of the executives who perhaps saw what had happened to us and err there was a huge amount of empathy so I really did feel early on there was a desire to help'

Robert Jake QC:- Yes - As you explain the position changed but the - the segue perhaps into that change is er some evidence you give into the Portuguese criminal system, now each culture, each nation has a slightly different criminal system and obviously there can be no criticism of about that what you say in Portugal is that there is no permitted interaction between the law enforcement agencies and the press - is that correct?

Gerry: That's correct!

Robert Jake QC:- and erm do you have a view about the possible draw backs of that - without being necessarily being critical but its pretty obvious that it give rise to the possibility of leaks does'nt it..


Yes Gerry we do remeber the unusual 'scenario' of 3 young children being left in an unlocked apartment. We also remember the reason for the change in the attitude of the press was down to the revelation that the shutters had not been jemmied (as per Kate) the images of you and especially Kate - stressed but not a distrought mother whos daughter was missing, jogging, Uncle John giving up his job, the fund and the growing discussion and public opinion over here that something was a-miss, an accident maybe

- but in those early days we remember it was'nt stacking up - the abduction story that is - that is what the press picked up - that is why they turned on you - nothing to do with the Portugese Police or Press for that matter - but the fact Kate lied started the ball rolling for you old son and then the rest of YOUR actions!

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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  Thistledown on Wed 23 Nov - 20:48

They wouldn't have been there if they thought they were in for a hard time. They did what we expected them to, used the inquiry as a platform to promote their own agenda ie. pulling at more gullible heartstrings and getting more donations in from the sheeple so they can make even more dosh out of suing people for using that freedom of speech Gerry said he was all for.

Also a good opportunity to throw a few snipes in the direction of the 3as and the likes.



No surprises really but it was interesting hearing what they had to say. The court really had no choice but to sympathise given their reason for being there but i'm quite sure Gez n Lord Lev had a wee friendly handshake and chat at some point prior to proceedings.

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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  ann_chovey on Wed 23 Nov - 21:00

[quote="Thistledown"]They wouldn't have been there if they thought they were in for a hard time. They did what we expected them to, used the inquiry as a platform to promote their own agenda ie. pulling at more gullible heartstrings and getting more donations in from the sheeple so they can make even more dosh out of suing people for using that freedom of speech Gerry said he was all for.

Also a good opportunity to throw a few snipes in the direction of the 3as and the likes.



No surprises really but it was interesting hearing what they had to say. The court really had no choice but to sympathise given their reason for being there but i'm quite sure Gez n Lord Lev had a wee friendly handshake and chat at some point prior to proceedings.[/quote]

So am I!!!

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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  the slave on Wed 23 Nov - 21:16

Katie gave the 'distress' signal quite clearly. Hand on neck . She's a player alright. What a piece of work.

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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  NoStone on Wed 23 Nov - 21:36

Gerry:- More sinister elements were starting to creep in to the reporting errm firstly the first really bad thing was an article that was written in a Portugese paper which was entitled 'Pact of Silence' and err was starting to refer that there was some sort of sinister agreement between us and our friends to cover up what had happened and I thought that was rather ludicrous considering that we were all acting under judicial secrecy - could'nt speak about the details of the event but that was probably June 2007....'

http://joana-morais.blogspot.com/2008/03/madeleine-case-pact-of-silence.html

“We have a pact. This is our matter only. It is nobody else’s business”, says David Payne.

Published in Sol, on June 30, 2007
by Felícia Cabrita and Margarida Davim

Madeleine’s parents and the friends with whom they spent their holidays in Praia da Luz are suspects in the inquiry. There are contradictory versions about the night of the kidnapping, and an assumed pact of silence in the group.

The beginning of June is flowing in an unusual way in the Algarve. A chilly wind and overhead clouds help to fill the auditorium of Lagos, where a solidarity concert is being held for the missing English girl. It’s been a month since Madeleine McCann vanished without a trace.

A few kilometres from Lagos, in the Ocean Club resort, in Praia da Luz, the faint illumination further densifies the ambience. At the reception, which leads to the Tapas restaurant, there is nobody. Getting inside is easy.

A Portuguese waiter, but with a British ‘behaviour’, strikes the first blow on the journalist’s plan: “We only serve dinner to the club’s clients”. “What about a drink?”. He says yes.

It’s 9.30pm If we were to believe the several members of the McCann’s holiday group, and after several mismatching versions, at this time Madeleine was being carried out of her apartment by a dark-haired man, who would be around 35 years old.

From the same table where the group of nine had dinner on that evening, one tries, in vain, to observe the apartment’s front – a ground floor apartment that faces the restaurant. A linoleum screen on the side of Tapas and the corridor of bushes that follows the limits of the apartment’s back yards prevents any vigilance to that level.

The image of Madeleine – big blue, questioning eyes and an innocent smile, fixed on the photographic films – is always present. It doesn’t leave the conversations of whom passes by. One remembers the words that the mother, Kate Healy, is supposed to have said to a friend (and that the husband, Gerry McCann, did not know): “I had a bad premonition about my children, when I found out the Ocean Club had no baby listening service”.

The choice of Algarve as a holiday destination would come to change their lives. Everything was arranged with three other couples, with whom they used to travel. Some of them had recently been to Greece, with their children, and the Mark Warner agency, the same that prepared their trip to the Algarve, had done their itinerary for the islands. According to their reports, the hotel where they stayed had a baby listening service – a service that is assured by four or five members of staff who would control the children while the adults dined, by listening through doors and windows to confirm that everything inside was quiet.

At the Tapas bar, from bartenders to staff from the Kid Club, criticism is whispered: “We have a crèche (Day care center) where they left their children for most part of the day, where they could be until 11.30 pm without spending another Euro. They could also have used our baby-sitters, who stay with the children in their rooms until 1 pm. In this case, they would have to pay an extra fee, but these people looked like they could afford it”, an employee comments, concluding that “this was a very strange group, that never stayed with their children”.

The children’s routine

The story of Madeleine looks like a tangled ball of wool. In the last days of April, Kate and Gerry, both 39 and doctors, arrive with their friends in Praia da Luz. The weather is not very good, but the group makes the best of it. The children seem to exist outside of the adults’ world. In the morning, Kate would take Madeleine, almost 4, and the 2-year old twins, to the Kid Club. The other couples in the group did the same. While the little ones entertained themselves with collages and paintings, the group divides itself between tennis and jogging until lunchtime. In the creche, the girl’s picture is taken: “She was shy and had some difficulty in adapting to the group. She always stayed close to the english children she already knew”.

It is at lunchtime that the families socialize a bit. After a short nap, the children go back to the Kid Club, while the parents use the activities that the club offers. They only get to meet again in the late afternoon, when the children’s dinner is served. Before 8 pm, Madeleine and her siblings, who seem to function like a clock, are already asleep. Half an hour later, the group of friends meets at Tapas. The staff remember that they only leave at midnight: “They were very lively and drank a bit too much. I didn’t even realize they had children, because I never saw them around”.

Mathew Oldfield, one of the elements of the group, is back in England. He reacts with surprise upon the contact of Sol, but he does not avoid the conversation: “We drank. We were on holidays. So what?”.

And thus the days followed one upon another, at the Ocean Club. The holiday week is almost over and the group’s spirit does not change. Nobody had noticed until then, how the children were kept at a distance.

The most reliable way to understand what happened on May 3, when Madeleine disappeared, is to analyse the various versions that emerged.

It would have been 10 pm when Kate decided to check the children at the apartment. This is the only moment in the story that gathers consensus. Madeleine had vanished from her bedroom and the twins were sleeping like nothing had happened. The mother was back at the restaurant in one leap. She was disoriented.

PJ called two hours later

In seconds, the resort is in turmoil. The group’s four men and the club’s employees check every corner. They seem to be oblivious of the essential: to call the authorities. GNR is the first to arrive at the scene, but the news only reach the Judiciary Police(PJ) more than two hours later. The first explanations arise. Where were the parents when the child disappeared? Gerry explains that, inspired in the scheme that some of the friends had used on their holidays in Greece, the nine members of the group took turns in checking on the children with some regularity.

This is the beginning of a story that will change in many chapters. Gerry starts by saying that he first left the table to check on the children around 9.05 p.m. When he entered the apartment the children were fine, he just noticed that the door to their bedroom was partially open. He looked at the window, which was closed, just as the shutters, and relaxed.

Ten minutes later, his friend Jane Tanner, who went around the apartments, crossed ways with a dark-haired man who was walking in the opposite direction, carrying a child. She didn’t make any connections either.

A few minutes later, Mathew Oldfield enters the room, sees the McCann children fast asleep, and notices nothing out of the ordinary. It is at 10 p.m. that Maddie’s mother discovers her daughter has disappeared. The window was wide open and the shutters were up.

To GNR, who is in the area with sniffer dogs to search for the child, this is a highly unlikely scenario. One of the military assures: “This is an extremely silent area, where there are practically no passing cars. That shutter was very difficult to lift from the outside, and would have made a lot of noise. It would have been a lot easier to use the door, but there were no signs of a break-in”.

This was just one of the reasons why the group became suspicious in the eyes of the investigators. Russell O’Brien, Jane Tanner’s husband, is already back in England, but he knows he could be summoned back to Portugal for a deposition anytime. Over the phone with Sol, he tries to keep his British phlegm: “It is normal that we are suspects, and the DNA test is a consequence thereof. We were the closest people involved”.

The conversation always comes back to the same issue: the night of the disappearance. The account of that last dinner has disparate versions among the group’s members. Some swear that someone left the table every half hour to check on the kids; other reduce that time to half of it. Some say control is made window by window; others say the adults entered each other’s apartments.

One of the employees that was on duty that evening does not remember a lot of movement: “I only remember a tall, grey-haired man getting up once from the table”. It was Russell, who, two days earlier, also had attended dinner.

An aerobic instructor from the resort entertains the dinner guests at Tapas with a ‘Quiz’. At 9.30 pm the game ends, and Gerry invites her to their table, where she stays for half an hour. During that time, as she later confided to friends, nobody left the table, but one of the chairs was vacant. Najova Chekaya refuses to talk to Sol. And Russell, when the questions start to surround him, loses his sympathy: “I have nothing further to tell you. I am not going to dishonour the compromise I assumed with Kate and Gerry. They want to control all information that is disclosed”.

Gerry changes his version several times, but he maintains that the door to his children’s room was open. Mat revokes his first statement: when he entered Madeleine’s room, the door was open and there was more light, as if the shutters had been raised. Here starts to develop the theory that there was already someone inside the apartment. Which reinforces Jane Tanner’s version (that she saw a man carrying a child).

Only Jane saw the man carrying a child

But there is a witness whose deposition contradicts this theory. Jeremy Wilkins – a TV producer who had met Maddie’s father during their holidays and used to play tennis with him – was walking his eight months old son at that time. He met Gerry, who went out through the apartment’s back door after having checked on the children, and the two man exchanged a brief conversation. At that time, if one is to believe the first accounts, Jane would have left Tapas in the direction of the apartment’s main entrance, and would have crossed paths with both of them. “It was a very narrow road and I think it would have been almost impossible to walk by without me taking notice”, Jeremy says, pointing out the fact that he saw no man carrying a child, as Jane states.

But Jane continues to guarantee that, at the top of the street, she saw a man with a child in his arms.

Although the area is scarcely lit, and the situation did not make her suspicious at the time, she describes the beige trousers, the dark thick jacket and the black classic-style shoes in a detailed way. Once again, Jeremy disagrees: “If that had happened, I would have likely seen it”.

On the next day, the media circus was fully installed. The first reports are on Sky News first thing in the morning, even before Portuguese press takes hold of the story. Journalists and locals dispute the information. Robert Murat, the son of an English mother and a Portuguese father, with little luck in business, does not waste the opportunity. He moves from failed businessman into the role of a translator for the press and the police. Some British journalists, after sucking him to the bones, start suspecting his availability.

The Murat contradiction

Contrarily to the GNR elements and the Ocean Club’s staff, who participated in the searches on the night before and assure they did not see Murat around, Gerry and some of his friends guarantee that he was there. And thus he becomes an arguido.

Gerry and Kate’s friends, who are interrogated tightly by the PJ over almost a month, refuse to clarify this contradiction, when asked by Sol. “We have a pact. This is our matter only. It is nobody else’s business”, says David Payne, another element with the group. Minutes after we tried to contact Kate, Gerry, in a fury, calls the Sol journalist: “What do you think you are doing? Do you think you’re better than the Portuguese police? I’m going to forward your contact to PJ and you will have to explain yourselves”.


PJ says ‘everybody is a suspect’

The director of the Judiciary Police in Faro, Guilhermino da Encarnação, confirmed with Sol that “we do not discard the possibility to have the family and friends as suspects”. This is always done “without neglecting other clues. Everybody who was at the resort at the time are suspects”.
(...)


We all know about the days after.....and about the secret tapas (pact) reunion.
According to the Times:

The parents of Madeleine McCann have denied that they held a secret meeting with the seven friends who dined with them on the night of their daughter’s disappearance to “get their stories straight”.

Related to 'Tapas 9' and McCanns secret meeting:


The Tapas Nine had wanted to keep the meeting secret (it was held at a hotel near Kate and Gerry McCanns' home in Rothley, Leicestershire) but yesterday details of it were leaked by a source close to the McCanns.

"It was a private meeting in a hotel and was the first time that the group had collectively met since Madeleine's disappearance," said the source (aka Clarence Mitchel

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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  ann_chovey on Wed 23 Nov - 21:44

the slave wrote:Katie gave the 'distress' signal quite clearly. Hand on neck . She's a player alright. What a piece of work.

A bit like this....?


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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  NoStone on Wed 23 Nov - 22:46

Did I hear that correctly - that they went with serialisation with NoW because they would back a 'formal review' of the case..

....o NoW influenced someone or some body to undertake the review!

Given the poor reputation of NoW with politicians and the police - would you question this?

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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  Lioned on Wed 23 Nov - 23:31

I conclude that once again the 'press's' love affair with the mccanns has overshadowed the genuine grief of the Dowlers.Once again the mccanns who are responsible in one way or another for the situation they are in have hijacked the show.

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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  bootsy on Wed 23 Nov - 23:54

Gerry was watching Kate like a hawk,fearfull she might let the cat out of the bag or even worse tell the truth.Evil pair of liars.

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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  Angelique on Thu 24 Nov - 1:53

Have watched the three videos HiDeHo has put up very kindly on another thread.

My own interpretation is they were handled with kid gloves - they were asked "very kindly" to state their own version of events. I really thought when they were asked about the PCC that Gerry had come unstuck but -Oh no, he then says they were friendly with Sir Christopher Meyer and wife and had verbal discussion. But I remember the interview with the head of the PCC some time ago and he said they discussed it over and over again with the McCanns and they were not interested in holding the papers to account. Well, obviously now it was so they could legitimately sue as Gerry has admitted.

No this was purely to get their "version" out there yet again. I am sure their questions had all the answers next to them in Gerry's folder - that's why Kate was forever looking at it.

What about the India sighting he said they got faxed a photo and said it was not Madeleine ? Also he mentioned about information not going to the authorities - huh! I thought they always asked for info to be sent directly to them. This is so annoying - how the version gets twisted slightly as time goes on.

IMO this was just another opportunity to garner sympathy, apply another layer of White stuff and said hello to fellow brothers.

ETA No mention that the British Police agreed with the Portuguese Police.

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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  Angelique on Thu 24 Nov - 2:30

Another thing I remember mention was made during the Enquiry about the Priest removing all the ribbons and pictures from the Church and that the McCanns had lost the support of the people in Praia da Luz. But they said that this was not true and that they still had the support from the Christian section of the people or words to that effect.

Is this another example if mis-information or manipulation of the truth under oath?

Something else I recall Gerry referred to suing The Express and referred to advice from Adam and Isobel - they of Carter Ruck - yes - so on first name terms then (I think Gerry did this first name dropping on purpose).Trouble is if the case is Re-opened and the Portuguese Police request the T9 to return they have plenty of legal support to resist any request. It will have to be something very compelling to allow this to happen.



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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  kitti on Thu 24 Nov - 6:23

I did notice Kate McCann reading from a script even when talking about the grief they went through.....grieving.



Can't even talk from the heart.....


Why mention the priest?


I thought their were over 100 articles that they sued the papers for....Yet only the 'sold to slavery' article was mentioned.....all it was about was the thing they can't dispute......the dogs...which didn't get a mention but they got round that another way....no blood....no DNA and no frozen corpse or bodily fluids....


The dogs scare them immensely ...

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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  blossom45 on Thu 24 Nov - 8:33

good morning all,
my feeling after the mccanns appearance on the winess stand
mainly that they came across as being very uncomfortable and nervy,
gerry was leading kate by the nose...by gesture and body language,
i also feel that leveson and his collegues are extremely clever people,
they have to be to have got where they are now,
it is their profession to spot a fraud a mile away.....
and i fully believe that they did yesterday afternoon.
i have watched all of the inquiry so far,
and in my opinion leveson didn't treat the mccanns any differently than he did any other witness,
he was the most polite and defferential of men,
and behind all his decent manner he was not fooled for a moment.
when the mccanns launched into their scripted hogwash,
their words were just brushed aside by the examiner as if to get the mccanns back on track.
no arse kissing and no preferential treatment...just the same polite treatment for all.

blossom45
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Re: Today's Conclusions!

Post  ann_chovey on Thu 24 Nov - 8:35

kitti wrote:I did notice Kate McCann reading from a script even when talking about the grief they went through.....grieving.



Can't even talk from the heart.....


Why mention the priest?


I thought their were over 100 articles that they sued the papers for....Yet only the 'sold to slavery' article was mentioned.....all it was about was the thing they can't dispute......the dogs...which didn't get a mention but they got round that another way....no blood....no DNA and no frozen corpse or bodily fluids....


The dogs scare them immensely ...


Most definitely kitti.



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Re: Today's Conclusions!

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