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Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

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Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  Annabel on Fri 23 Dec - 10:07

http://goodqualitywristbands.blogspot.com/

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  Panda on Fri 23 Dec - 10:50

Thanks Annabel,

A person can request to be made "arguida" because he or she will benefit
from rights that he/she does not have as a witness. Apart of the
obligation of being accompanied by a lawyer when giving depositions in
front of police authorities, the arguido has the right to remain silent
and not reply to any questions. This means that as a potential suspect
he or she is acting in their own defence. A witness by law is obliged to
reply to all questions."

So now we know why Kate refused to answer the questions, I still say she was tired and annoyed at the inane questions rather than worried she would
be charged.

Meant to comment on the poster of Glenfields with the old dear sticking her finger up at Gerry.......excellent

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  gillyspot on Fri 23 Dec - 17:14

I am sure that the McCanns lawyer told her she didn't need to answer the questions and she and Gerry agreed they wouldn't He then changed his mind and answered but Kate didn't, choosing to say "fuxing tosser" under hear breath instead.

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  Panda on Fri 23 Dec - 17:25

gillyspot wrote:I am sure that the McCanns lawyer told her she didn't need to answer the questions and she and Gerry agreed they wouldn't He then changed his mind and answered but Kate didn't, choosing to say "fuxing tosser" under hear breath instead.

Hi gillyspot, I don"t remember reading the questions Gerry was asked, but Gerry"s Mother said Kate lost her temper with him one day in Portugal and said
"it"s me they are after, not you", why would she say that?

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  gillyspot on Fri 23 Dec - 17:32

The PJ were concerned because she refused to answer the questions and Gerry had answered them. Also they felt she had been there alone with the kids in the evening and Gerry was apparently accounted for by other witnesses.

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  pennylane on Fri 23 Dec - 17:39

Panda wrote:
gillyspot wrote:I am sure that the McCanns lawyer told her she didn't need to answer the questions and she and Gerry agreed they wouldn't He then changed his mind and answered but Kate didn't, choosing to say "fuxing tosser" under hear breath instead.

Hi gillyspot, I don"t remember reading the questions Gerry was asked, but Gerry"s Mother said Kate lost her temper with him one day in Portugal and said "it"s me they are after, not you", why would she say that?

Hi Panda, I think it was Kate that was under the most suspicion from the get go as having sedated Maddie, leading to her tragic death. Certainly most people I spoke to thought Kate was most likely the perpetrator.

The 'Mummy crying' episode is also a bone of contention for KM, and she has since gone out of her way to state that when Maddie allegedly asked 'why didn't you come' etc...... it was not prefaced with 'Mummy' but just generally....

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  Panda on Fri 23 Dec - 17:45

pennylane wrote:
Panda wrote:
gillyspot wrote:I am sure that the McCanns lawyer told her she didn't need to answer the questions and she and Gerry agreed they wouldn't He then changed his mind and answered but Kate didn't, choosing to say "fuxing tosser" under hear breath instead.

Hi gillyspot, I don"t remember reading the questions Gerry was asked, but Gerry"s Mother said Kate lost her temper with him one day in Portugal and said "it"s me they are after, not you", why would she say that?

Hi Panda, I think it was Kate that was under the most suspicion from the get go as having sedated Maddie, leading to a tragic death. Certainly most people I spoke to thought Kate was most likely the perpetrator.

The 'Mummy crying' episode is also a bone of contention for KM, and she has since gone out of her way to state that when Maddie allegedly asked 'why didn't you come' etc...... it was not prefaced with 'Mummy' but just generally....

Hi pennylane,

when the matter was broached during T.V. interviews Kate says lamely "we thought it was something and nothing, and Madeleine soon forgot", I think
Mrs Fenn or another person had reported the crying to the OC Management and that is why Kate made up the conversation with Madeleiene to
trivialise the matter.

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  pennylane on Fri 23 Dec - 18:00

Panda wrote:
pennylane wrote:
Panda wrote:
gillyspot wrote:I am sure that the McCanns lawyer told her she didn't need to answer the questions and she and Gerry agreed they wouldn't He then changed his mind and answered but Kate didn't, choosing to say "fuxing tosser" under hear breath instead.

Hi gillyspot, I don"t remember reading the questions Gerry was asked, but Gerry"s Mother said Kate lost her temper with him one day in Portugal and said "it"s me they are after, not you", why would she say that?

Hi Panda, I think it was Kate that was under the most suspicion from the get go as having sedated Maddie, leading to her tragic death. Certainly most people I spoke to thought Kate was most likely the perpetrator.

The 'Mummy crying' episode is also a bone of contention for KM, and she has since gone out of her way to state that when Maddie allegedly asked 'why didn't you come' etc...... it was not prefaced with 'Mummy' but just generally....

Hi pennylane,

when the matter was broached during T.V. interviews Kate says lamely "we thought it was something and nothing, and Madeleine soon forgot", I think Mrs Fenn or another person had reported the crying to the OC Management and that is why Kate made up the conversation with Madeleiene to trivialise the matter.

Totally agree Panda! Not only to trivialise it, but to confuse the day it occurred via "...when sean and I were crying last night"

You can tell the crying was significant, or they wouldn't have tried so hard to trivialise it as you point out.

And then in typical McCann style, they attempt to quickly redirect the sheeples attention back on to the phantom abductor, by inferring he was probably in the apt at the time, causing the children to wake up and cry.

pleeeeeeease.... give me strength!

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  Panda on Fri 23 Dec - 18:10

The more you read pennylane and watch the interviews the more we have to wonder WHY the PJ let them escape back to the U.K.

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  pennylane on Fri 23 Dec - 18:19

Panda wrote:The more you read pennylane and watch the interviews the more we have to wonder WHY the PJ let them escape back to the U.K.

I think the Home Office made sure the investigation stalled by its utter lack of cooperation with turning over any background information on the dodgy duo, added to that the enormous uproar and political pressure that descended on PDL, not to mention getting rid of Goncalo Amaral before he could follow up the important red flags and leads in the investigation.

The investigation was doomed to be 'shelved' imo. And if anyone believes NSY will be working independently of the direction of the Home Office who are conveniently, as it turns out, paying for the Review, I think they are in for a bitter disappointment. Hope I'm wrong, I really do.

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  Panda on Fri 23 Dec - 18:30

pennylane wrote:
Panda wrote:The more you read pennylane and watch the interviews the more we have to wonder WHY the PJ let them escape back to the U.K.

I think the Home Office made sure the investigation stalled by its utter lack of cooperation with turning over any background information on the dodgy duo, added to that the enormous uproar and political pressure that descended on PDL, not to mention getting rid of Goncalo Amaral before he could follow up the important red flags and leads in the investigation.

The investigation was doomed to be 'shelved' imo. And if anyone believes NSY will be working independently of the direction of the Home Office who are conveniently, as it turns out, paying for the Review, I think they are in for a bitter disappointment. Hope I'm wrong, I really do.

Yes, I"m inclined to agree, especially because NSY allowed themselves to be filmed carrying all those boxes and they were in Spain checking out the
victoria beckham look alike sighting.........bad move whoever is in charge of the investigation allowing this to happen.

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  Wintabells on Fri 23 Dec - 18:34

pennylane wrote:
The 'Mummy crying' episode is also a bone of contention for KM, and she has since gone out of her way to state that when Maddie allegedly asked 'why didn't you come' etc...... it was not prefaced with 'Mummy' but just generally....

And yet in her diary entry (some sort of shorthand version which is replicated in the link below)
http://forum2.aimoo.com/MadeleineMcCann/Discrepancies-by-Topic/Pre-emptive-Avoidance-Confusion-Discrepancies-1-777555.html

Thursday 03.05.2007 - The day of the disappearance
Breakfast - Apartment
Comment Madeleine "Where were you (was I) when me and S cried?"
Kids club, time - check registration
09.00-09.30 → 12:30
Sailing (beach)
Wash M top of pyjamas - big stain
Lunch? apartment? tea
Tennis lesson 09.15-10.15
conversation on the grass w / Russell and Nigel (the video camera)
[?] Minutes of tennis
K
? get Madeleine
J and Fiona (Scarlett)
Then pick up S and A
(? Meeting there with G)
Breakfast - apartment -? balcony
? recreational area - ok
Afternoon / Kids club - a bit later
K Ella already there
Swimming - indoors pool
K and G - practice tennis then lesson and coach Dan
15.30 - 16.30
Julian appeared - continued to play with Gerry
I went to run → beach
(rest of the group on the beach)
Gerry went to meet the kids for high tea at Tapas. I joined them after running.
+ / - 17.20-17.30
[Strikethrough text illegible]
M very tired and quiet
Since Ella was taken from the KC → beach. I was a little worried that she was sad to have been alone. (Not realised that the group had gone to the beach.)
She said she was fine.
She asked me to pick her up and said she was tired.
I picked her up and carried her to the apartment with G and S and A
Prepared bath as kids tired and men's tennis night at 18.00.
I considered returning to the recreation area with the kids but decided to stay in the apartment after bath and hair wash.

G men's tennis night
B pyjamas
Biscuits and milk for the kids - left them with this and books and games and went to take a quick bath / wash my hair.
I got out of the bath and David was knocking on the patio doors.
I wrapped myself in a towel and went into the living room.
He asked if we wanted to go to the recreational area, since he could help me take the kids.
Refused - since kids ready for bed.
I dressed myself.
Ate some snacks with the kids
M tired - sitting on my lap - read story of MOG
Brush teeth
To bedroom with kids
G there too - I think.
[Children's music] - M telling story
M removes and lowers head on pillow

S + A good-night kisses for M
From S and A → cots x2
K gave a good-night kiss to M
Leaned the door as much as possible without closing it.
Silence
? dry hair
Make-up
Glass of wine
20:35 → rest. First to arrive
21:00 → G, Conversation with Steve
21:30 → Matt, Carolyn (Note: Carolyn is a witness who says she heard someone calling Madeleine's name, around 21:30, as she walked back to her apartment)
22:00 → Myself, 20:40 Jane next
20:45 Matt and Rachael
Russell?
Detained
Evie feeling sick
R went for a long time
Jane replaced him

[Three pages with drawings]


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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  pennylane on Fri 23 Dec - 19:10

Panda wrote:
pennylane wrote:
Panda wrote:The more you read pennylane and watch the interviews the more we have to wonder WHY the PJ let them escape back to the U.K.

I think the Home Office made sure the investigation stalled by its utter lack of cooperation with turning over any background information on the dodgy duo, added to that the enormous uproar and political pressure that descended on PDL, not to mention getting rid of Goncalo Amaral before he could follow up the important red flags and leads in the investigation.

The investigation was doomed to be 'shelved' imo. And if anyone believes NSY will be working independently of the direction of the Home Office who are conveniently, as it turns out, paying for the Review, I think they are in for a bitter disappointment. Hope I'm wrong, I really do.

Yes, I"m inclined to agree, especially because NSY allowed themselves to be filmed carrying all those boxes and they were in Spain checking out the
victoria beckham look alike sighting.........bad move whoever is in charge of the investigation allowing this to happen.

We should be used to this epic farce by now..... but still to this day, I feel overwhelmed by the sleaze and corruption that surrounds this dodgy pair. It isn't even remotely subtle for the most part, and I find it deeply depressing at times.

I thank my lucky stars for my astute friends here at MM.

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  pennylane on Fri 23 Dec - 19:22

Wintabells wrote:
pennylane wrote:
The 'Mummy crying' episode is also a bone of contention for KM, and she has since gone out of her way to state that when Maddie allegedly asked 'why didn't you come' etc...... it was not prefaced with 'Mummy' but just generally....

And yet in her diary entry (some sort of shorthand version which is replicated in the link below)
http://forum2.aimoo.com/MadeleineMcCann/Discrepancies-by-Topic/Pre-emptive-Avoidance-Confusion-Discrepancies-1-777555.html

Thursday 03.05.2007 - The day of the disappearance
Breakfast - Apartment
Comment Madeleine "Where were you (was I) when me and S cried?"
Kids club, time - check registration
09.00-09.30 → 12:30
Sailing (beach)
Wash M top of pyjamas - big stain
Lunch? apartment? tea
Tennis lesson 09.15-10.15
conversation on the grass w / Russell and Nigel (the video camera)
[?] Minutes of tennis
K
? get Madeleine
J and Fiona (Scarlett)
Then pick up S and A
(? Meeting there with G)
Breakfast - apartment -? balcony
? recreational area - ok
Afternoon / Kids club - a bit later
K Ella already there
Swimming - indoors pool
K and G - practice tennis then lesson and coach Dan
15.30 - 16.30
Julian appeared - continued to play with Gerry
I went to run → beach
(rest of the group on the beach)
Gerry went to meet the kids for high tea at Tapas. I joined them after running.
+ / - 17.20-17.30
[Strikethrough text illegible]
M very tired and quiet
Since Ella was taken from the KC → beach. I was a little worried that she was sad to have been alone. (Not realised that the group had gone to the beach.)
She said she was fine.
She asked me to pick her up and said she was tired.
I picked her up and carried her to the apartment with G and S and A
Prepared bath as kids tired and men's tennis night at 18.00.
I considered returning to the recreation area with the kids but decided to stay in the apartment after bath and hair wash.

G men's tennis night
B pyjamas
Biscuits and milk for the kids - left them with this and books and games and went to take a quick bath / wash my hair.
I got out of the bath and David was knocking on the patio doors.
I wrapped myself in a towel and went into the living room.
He asked if we wanted to go to the recreational area, since he could help me take the kids.
Refused - since kids ready for bed.
I dressed myself.
Ate some snacks with the kids
M tired - sitting on my lap - read story of MOG
Brush teeth
To bedroom with kids
G there too - I think.
[Children's music] - M telling story
M removes and lowers head on pillow

S + A good-night kisses for M
From S and A → cots x2
K gave a good-night kiss to M
Leaned the door as much as possible without closing it.
Silence
? dry hair
Make-up
Glass of wine
20:35 → rest. First to arrive
21:00 → G, Conversation with Steve
21:30 → Matt, Carolyn (Note: Carolyn is a witness who says she heard someone calling Madeleine's name, around 21:30, as she walked back to her apartment)
22:00 → Myself, 20:40 Jane next
20:45 Matt and Rachael
Russell?
Detained
Evie feeling sick
R went for a long time
Jane replaced him

[Three pages with drawings]


Thank you Wintabells

Since that alleged conversation with Maddie never took place (imho), I think Kate got exactly what she deserved from those damaging headlines that greeted the pair upon their return from Brussels!

It's a little bit of Karma.... and I sincerely hope a whole lot more is heading their way beginning February 2012!

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  Panda on Fri 23 Dec - 20:16

Well girls, you surprise me.......you never noticed the glaring error. Kate"s Diary Started 3rd May BEFORE Madeleine went missing, so what was all the
nonsense from Philomena and I think one of the Family Lawyers about suggesting she start a Diary.

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  pennylane on Fri 23 Dec - 20:25

Panda wrote:Well girls, you surprise me.......you never noticed the glaring error. Kate"s Diary Started 3rd May BEFORE Madeleine went missing, so what was all the
nonsense from Philomena and I think one of the Family Lawyers about suggesting she start a Diary.


I suppose KM would say she backdated to the phantom abductor day.
It's all fictional thoughts and fictional occurrences anyway imo.

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  Panda on Fri 23 Dec - 20:33

pennylane wrote:
Panda wrote:Well girls, you surprise me.......you never noticed the glaring error. Kate"s Diary Started 3rd May BEFORE Madeleine went missing, so what was all the
nonsense from Philomena and I think one of the Family Lawyers about suggesting she start a Diary.


I suppose KM would say she backdated to the phantom abductor day.
It's all fictional thoughts and fictional occurrences anyway imo.

I tell you what pennylane, if we had been Portugese Detectives after the Rack and the Water torture the McCanns would soon have confessed.

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  tigger on Fri 23 Dec - 20:41

pennylane wrote:
Panda wrote:Well girls, you surprise me.......you never noticed the glaring error. Kate"s Diary Started 3rd May BEFORE Madeleine went missing, so what was all the
nonsense from Philomena and I think one of the Family Lawyers about suggesting she start a Diary.


I suppose KM would say she backdated to the phantom abductor day.
It's all fictional thoughts and fictional occurrences anyway imo.

As I understood it, she did start the diary some days or weeks after the 3rd, working from notes she made in her (appointments) diary.
Kate's memory is astounding, total recall by the looks of it.

By the way, main reason they were after her, is because she is allegedly a fully qualified anaesthetist. A job which would pay extremely well as long, so why have I never heard of her practicing part time? Why was she working as a part time GP which pays a lot less.

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  pennylane on Fri 23 Dec - 20:57

Panda wrote:
pennylane wrote:
Panda wrote:Well girls, you surprise me.......you never noticed the glaring error. Kate"s Diary Started 3rd May BEFORE Madeleine went missing, so what was all the
nonsense from Philomena and I think one of the Family Lawyers about suggesting she start a Diary.


I suppose KM would say she backdated to the phantom abductor day.
It's all fictional thoughts and fictional occurrences anyway imo.

I tell you what pennylane, if we had been Portugese Detectives after the Rack and the Water torture the McCanns would soon have confessed.

You got that right, Panda. We'd have got to the truth in record breaking time!

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  Panda on Fri 23 Dec - 20:59

tigger wrote:
pennylane wrote:
Panda wrote:Well girls, you surprise me.......you never noticed the glaring error. Kate"s Diary Started 3rd May BEFORE Madeleine went missing, so what was all the
nonsense from Philomena and I think one of the Family Lawyers about suggesting she start a Diary.


I suppose KM would say she backdated to the phantom abductor day.
It's all fictional thoughts and fictional occurrences anyway imo.

As I understood it, she did start the diary some days or weeks after the 3rd, working from notes she made in her (appointments) diary.
Kate's memory is astounding, total recall by the looks of it.

By the way, main reason they were after her, is because she is allegedly a fully qualified anaesthetist. A job which would pay extremely well as long, so why have I never heard of her practicing part time? Why was she working as a part time GP which pays a lot less.

Yes tigger, I read that Kate was an anaesthatist but she was still on Maternity leave when they went to PDL. Apparently she was finding it hard to cope with 3 young children , only 20 months between Madeleine and the twins so I sympathise with her there. I think that is why she only worked one and a half days a week in a local Practice.

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  Panda on Fri 23 Dec - 21:00

Panda wrote:
tigger wrote:
pennylane wrote:
Panda wrote:Well girls, you surprise me.......you never noticed the glaring error. Kate"s Diary Started 3rd May BEFORE Madeleine went missing, so what was all the
nonsense from Philomena and I think one of the Family Lawyers about suggesting she start a Diary.


I suppose KM would say she backdated to the phantom abductor day.
It's all fictional thoughts and fictional occurrences anyway imo.

As I understood it, she did start the diary some days or weeks after the 3rd, working from notes she made in her (appointments) diary.
Kate's memory is astounding, total recall by the looks of it.

By the way, main reason they were after her, is because she is allegedly a fully qualified anaesthetist. A job which would pay extremely well as long, so why have I never heard of her practicing part time? Why was she working as a part time GP which pays a lot less.

Yes tigger, I read that Kate was an anaesthatist but she was still on Maternity leave when they went to PDL. Apparently she was finding it hard to cope with 3 young children , only 20 months between Madeleine and the twins so I sympathise with her there. I think that is why she only worked one and a half days a week in a local Practice.

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  Panda on Fri 23 Dec - 21:03

pennylane wrote:
Panda wrote:
pennylane wrote:
Panda wrote:Well girls, you surprise me.......you never noticed the glaring error. Kate"s Diary Started 3rd May BEFORE Madeleine went missing, so what was all the
nonsense from Philomena and I think one of the Family Lawyers about suggesting she start a Diary.


I suppose KM would say she backdated to the phantom abductor day.
It's all fictional thoughts and fictional occurrences anyway imo.

I tell you what pennylane, if we had been Portugese Detectives after the Rack and the Water torture the McCanns would soon have confessed.

You got that right, Panda. We'd have got to the truth in record breaking time!

Think of all the money we would have saved the PJ and LP ! Not to mention Police Forces around the world chasing up sightings.

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  pennylane on Fri 23 Dec - 21:09

tigger wrote:
pennylane wrote:
Panda wrote:Well girls, you surprise me.......you never noticed the glaring error. Kate"s Diary Started 3rd May BEFORE Madeleine went missing, so what was all the
nonsense from Philomena and I think one of the Family Lawyers about suggesting she start a Diary.


I suppose KM would say she backdated to the phantom abductor day.
It's all fictional thoughts and fictional occurrences anyway imo.

As I understood it, she did start the diary some days or weeks after the 3rd, working from notes she made in her (appointments) diary.
Kate's memory is astounding, total recall by the looks of it.

By the way, main reason they were after her, is because she is allegedly a fully qualified anaesthetist. A job which would pay extremely well as long, so why have I never heard of her practicing part time? Why was she working as a part time GP which pays a lot less.

Good question tigger. It is odd how Kate's training in New Zealand as an anaesthetist seems to have gone by the ways side.

I can certainly see why she didn't brag about it at the time of the phantom abduction though.

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  Guest on Fri 23 Dec - 21:36

IIRC she never actually qualified as an anaesthetist, she's certainly not registered as such with the GMC. And here's another interesting fact about Kate's career in NZ (somebody on Jill's found this out). She worked in a very small children's hospital in Auckland called the Starship; the very same hospital where nanny Charlotte Pennington was a charity fundraiser. Coincidence or wot.

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

Post  Panda on Fri 23 Dec - 21:43

Iris wrote:IIRC she never actually qualified as an anaesthetist, she's certainly not registered as such with the GMC. And here's another interesting fact about Kate's career in NZ (somebody on Jill's found this out). She worked in a very small children's hospital in Auckland called the Starship; the very same hospital where nanny Charlotte Pennington was a charity fundraiser. Coincidence or wot.

Hi Iris,

I remember reading that Charlotte went to Rothley to visit the McCanns when she finished the Season in PDL and it was known that she knew Kate from
New Zealand. Wasn"t it Charlotte who arrived at 5a and heard Kate saying "wev"e let her down"?

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Re: Portuguese Law - The 'Arguido' Status/Himself

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