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Re: Trolls

Post  almostgothic on Fri 13 Jan - 12:57

HiDeHo - snap!
I do all that stuff too.

I first discovered the usefulness of those little tricks when I noticed years back that a long-standing pro troll would use a certain word quite regularly and always misspelled it in exactly the same way. Thus, any of their new socks would be revealed!
Grammatical errors are useful too because they are usually repeated.

Also, there is the style of writing which, even when initially disguised, emerges eventually. I have a list in my head which includes such things as 'long-winded', 'penchant for long embedded quotes', 'passive-aggressive', 'authoritarian', 'pompous' etc.

All grist to the mill. And not done to cynically 'out' a person, but more a clue as to if said person is on the level or not.

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Re: Trolls

Post  gillyspot on Fri 13 Jan - 12:59

I have always found that the one topic the trolls attack me most on is my questions about the McCanns fund. I have always found this odd as they spend hours saying it is transparent etc but giving no evidence of the same.

Platinum was a prime one as is inky on twitter saying I lied about the McCanns "fund" accounts being overdue.

Well Guess what - they were overdue?

Thanks to Nigel at McCannfiles for screensaving this link from Companies House.

http://www.mccannfiles.com/imagelib/sitebuilder/misc/show_image.html?linkedwidth=actual&linkpath=http://www.mccannfiles.com/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/MFAccountsoverdue.JPG&target=tlx_picxtis

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Re: Trolls

Post  chrissie on Fri 13 Jan - 12:59

Thankk you both for that little trick. I've just tried it out and it works
almostgothic wrote:HiDeHo - snap!
I do all that stuff too.

I first discovered the usefulness of those little tricks when I noticed years back that a long-standing pro troll would use a certain word quite regularly and always misspelled it in exactly the same way. Thus, any of their new socks would be revealed!
Grammatical errors are useful too because they are usually repeated.

Also, there is the style of writing which, even when initially disguised, emerges eventually. I have a list in my head which includes such things as 'long-winded', 'penchant for long embedded quotes', 'passive-aggressive', 'authoritarian', 'pompous' etc.

All grist to the mill. And not done to cynically 'out' a person, but more a clue as to if said person is on the level or not.

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Re: Trolls

Post  HiDeHo on Fri 13 Jan - 13:35

THE most difficult thing to do is to IGNORE irrelevant disruptive trolls, but the fact is they cannot continue with no responses.

In real life, the worst reaction you can have to someone is to not care. They are devastated they are not important to you.

Even a negative reaction shows they are worthwhile and they feed off that.

Try it....next time someone says something that makes you angry or upset, just walk away. You take away their control.

The second you respond to them shows they have gained control over your feelings.

It works the other way too. If you need to tell someone about how they have upset you or what they have done that makes you angry, you want them to respond so you can continue to argue your side of the story. You seek validation.

If that person shrugs their shoulders and walks away it leaves you frustrated and angry because you can no longer control the situation.

Trolls feel that too......by ignoring them you take away their control and leave them frustrated and angry with nowhere to go, because noone cares.

Ignoring someone is the worst kind of insult.

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Re: Trolls

Post  AnnaEsse on Fri 13 Jan - 13:44

There are people who tend to lurk around this and other fora and only contribute when specific issues are being discussed. The dogs? here comes ****. Gasper? Oh oh! Here's so-and-so! Very often when these lurkers join in, the topic degenerates, not because a contrary opinion is not welcome, but because of the way people choose to express that opinion. I'd love it if a pro joined us and gave me good reasons to believe that Madeleine McCann was well and happy somewhere and could be found. That would be wonderful, but so far, when they join us all they tend to do is end up insulting people, rather than give good reasons for their own opinions. Not helpful!

_________________________________________________________________________________________________
"You can run on for a long time, Run on for a long time, Run on for a long time, Sooner or later God'll cut you down." (Johnny Cash)

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Re: Trolls

Post  Claudia79 on Fri 13 Jan - 15:08

Velvet wrote:Oh what a shame, it was nice to see a completely different opinion to the majority of posters. Afterall what's a debate when everyone has almost similar views! I'm probably one of the few who will miss there intriguing posts.

If intriguing now means telling other posters what to post and where to post it and telling mods that threads are relevant or irrelevant and that threads should or shouldn't stay in certain areas of the forum, then yes, very intriguing indeed.

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Re: Trolls

Post  Velvet on Fri 13 Jan - 15:28

Claudia79 wrote:
Velvet wrote:Oh what a shame, it was nice to see a completely different opinion to the majority of posters. Afterall what's a debate when everyone has almost similar views! I'm probably one of the few who will miss there intriguing posts.

If intriguing now means telling other posters what to post and where to post it and telling mods that threads are relevant or irrelevant and that threads should or shouldn't stay in certain areas of the forum, then yes, very intriguing indeed.

Yes I agree some of there posts were not brilliant, but they did write enough on there very short stay here to make some interesting points!

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Re: Trolls

Post  Claudia79 on Fri 13 Jan - 15:31

Velvet wrote:
Claudia79 wrote:
Velvet wrote:Oh what a shame, it was nice to see a completely different opinion to the majority of posters. Afterall what's a debate when everyone has almost similar views! I'm probably one of the few who will miss there intriguing posts.

If intriguing now means telling other posters what to post and where to post it and telling mods that threads are relevant or irrelevant and that threads should or shouldn't stay in certain areas of the forum, then yes, very intriguing indeed.

Yes I agree some of there posts were not brilliant, but they did write enough on there very short stay here to make some interesting points!

If 'they' hadn't tried to control what is posted and where on this forum, the stay would have been longer. A little bit, at least.

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Re: Trolls

Post  Guest on Fri 13 Jan - 15:32

Velvet wrote:
Claudia79 wrote:
Velvet wrote:Oh what a shame, it was nice to see a completely different opinion to the majority of posters. Afterall what's a debate when everyone has almost similar views! I'm probably one of the few who will miss there intriguing posts.

If intriguing now means telling other posters what to post and where to post it and telling mods that threads are relevant or irrelevant and that threads should or shouldn't stay in certain areas of the forum, then yes, very intriguing indeed.

Yes I agree some of there posts were not brilliant, but they did write enough on there very short stay here to make some interesting points!

Can you give your favourite example as most of their posts were so far removed from issues surrounding the disappearance of Madeleine that it became very difficult indeed to follow.

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Re: Trolls

Post  Velvet on Fri 13 Jan - 15:37

The End Is Nigh wrote:No doubt - people are only human and not everyone can be broad shouldered in the face of an unpleasant onslaught of rapid-fire posting that demands far,far more than it gives.

I thought that particular poster was female, though, not that it matters.

But as for getting through the trees as far as the wood, these episodes help mightily in reminded the open-minded just how incredible the utterances and behaviours from those who insist Madeleine was abducted were (and still are).

Oops thought that poster was a man, my bad!

I agree with you, the behaviour of many of the 'pro's' is appalling, as is some of the so called 'anti's' on other sites. I tend to stay on here now because of that reason. I know because I haven't wrote many posts people may assume I am a 'sleeping troll' but I can assure you that is not the case. I am new to forums and obviously never picked out platinum as someone with malicious intent. Just someone who seemed to know a lot on the case!!

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Re: Trolls

Post  dutchclogs on Fri 13 Jan - 15:51

HiDeHo wrote:THE most difficult thing to do is to IGNORE irrelevant disruptive trolls, but the fact is they cannot continue with no responses.

In real life, the worst reaction you can have to someone is to not care. They are devastated they are not important to you.

Even a negative reaction shows they are worthwhile and they feed off that.

Try it....next time someone says something that makes you angry or upset, just walk away. You take away their control.

The second you respond to them shows they have gained control over your feelings.

It works the other way too. If you need to tell someone about how they have upset you or what they have done that makes you angry, you want them to respond so you can continue to argue your side of the story. You seek validation.

If that person shrugs their shoulders and walks away it leaves you frustrated and angry because you can no longer control the situation.

Trolls feel that too......by ignoring them you take away their control and leave them frustrated and angry with nowhere to go, because noone cares.

Ignoring someone is the worst kind of insult.

It's hard for me not to fight with people like that (on Twitter) but I do agree with you HiDeHo with what you say. So now I just block them. and you know it makes me feel better.

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Re: Trolls

Post  Oldartform on Fri 13 Jan - 16:52

AnnaEsse wrote:There are people who tend to lurk around this and other fora and only contribute when specific issues are being discussed. The dogs? here comes ****. Gasper? Oh oh! Here's so-and-so! Very often when these lurkers join in, the topic degenerates, not because a contrary opinion is not welcome, but because of the way people choose to express that opinion. I'd love it if a pro joined us and gave me good reasons to believe that Madeleine McCann was well and happy somewhere and could be found. That would be wonderful, but so far, when they join us all they tend to do is end up insulting people, rather than give good reasons for their own opinions. Not helpful!

Agreed. Also I am more interested in `the case` and `justice`. I have tried coming from the perspective of the couple being totally innocent and putting all my prejudices aside, but I`m afraid it just does not ring true. However I don`t agree with every statement that purports their guilt and will say so.

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Re: Trolls

Post  Lioned on Fri 13 Jan - 18:35

malena stool wrote:
Velvet wrote:Oh what a shame, it was nice to see a completely different opinion to the majority of posters. Afterall what's a debate when everyone has almost similar views! I'm probably one of the few who will miss there intriguing posts.
Hi Velvet, I fail to see the point in joining a forum in which the members express complete and totally opposite opinions to ones own... other than to gather information and/or disrupt the subjects being discussed.

Indeed.There are a number of things you can only have intelligent debate with your very best friends and close relatives.This includes Religion,football and the mccanns.
Platinum was dishonest.He had been here before and been banned.He was only here to disrupt ,as are any that claim to support the mccanns.There is no debate here for those who support child neglect.

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Re: Trolls

Post  Not Born Yesterday on Fri 13 Jan - 18:39

As mentioned before I'm 99% sure that he was also on the Jill Havern forum as Xavier and his behaviour there was beneath contempt; much like the people he supports in fact.

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Re: Trolls

Post  jejune on Fri 13 Jan - 22:53

HiDeHo wrote:THE most difficult thing to do is to IGNORE irrelevant disruptive trolls, but the fact is they cannot continue with no responses.

In real life, the worst reaction you can have to someone is to not care. They are devastated they are not important to you.

Even a negative reaction shows they are worthwhile and they feed off that.

Try it....next time someone says something that makes you angry or upset, just walk away. You take away their control.

The second you respond to them shows they have gained control over your feelings.

It works the other way too. If you need to tell someone about how they have upset you or what they have done that makes you angry, you want them to respond so you can continue to argue your side of the story. You seek validation.

If that person shrugs their shoulders and walks away it leaves you frustrated and angry because you can no longer control the situation.

Trolls feel that too......by ignoring them you take away their control and leave them frustrated and angry with nowhere to go, because noone cares.

Ignoring someone is the worst kind of insult.


That sounds like good advice in the real world. It may seem obvious, but it's easy to jump to a reaction when we feel offended. I'm going to bear this in mind - thanks

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Re: Trolls

Post  gillyspot on Fri 13 Jan - 22:57

Not Born Yesterday wrote:As mentioned before I'm 99% sure that he was also on the Jill Havern forum as Xavier and his behaviour there was beneath contempt; much like the people he supports in fact.

I am with you Not Born. The syntax and arguments are very similar. The point is who cares though. You can spot these trolls at 100 paces. Best to question them - as I enjoyed myself with platinum. PS if you are reading this YES the McCanns were LATE filing their accounts so I was not "lying".

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Re: Trolls

Post  jejune on Fri 13 Jan - 23:20

Oldartform wrote:
AnnaEsse wrote:There are people who tend to lurk around this and other fora and only contribute when specific issues are being discussed. The dogs? here comes ****. Gasper? Oh oh! Here's so-and-so! Very often when these lurkers join in, the topic degenerates, not because a contrary opinion is not welcome, but because of the way people choose to express that opinion. I'd love it if a pro joined us and gave me good reasons to believe that Madeleine McCann was well and happy somewhere and could be found. That would be wonderful, but so far, when they join us all they tend to do is end up insulting people, rather than give good reasons for their own opinions. Not helpful!

Agreed. Also I am more interested in `the case` and `justice`. I have tried coming from the perspective of the couple being totally innocent and putting all my prejudices aside, but I`m afraid it just does not ring true. However I don`t agree with every statement that purports their guilt and will say so.


I have never - since following this case in the Mirror forum, through 3As, and now here - seen anybody offer any bit of evidence as to why Madeleine is a) alive, or b) was abducted. The only reasoning that ever seems to be put forward is that Madeleine's not here (so she must have been abducted), and her body hasn't been found (so she must be alive). The reasoning for the McCanns being totally innocent is that they haven't been charged with anything. There may not be the evidence to put anybody in court, but I'm damn certain that the absence of a child, and a lack of forensic evidence, wouldn't be enough in the UK to make the assumption of abduction by a stranger, so why should anybody expect it to in Portugal?

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Re: Trolls

Post  flower on Fri 13 Jan - 23:28

jejune wrote:
Oldartform wrote:
AnnaEsse wrote:There are people who tend to lurk around this and other fora and only contribute when specific issues are being discussed. The dogs? here comes ****. Gasper? Oh oh! Here's so-and-so! Very often when these lurkers join in, the topic degenerates, not because a contrary opinion is not welcome, but because of the way people choose to express that opinion. I'd love it if a pro joined us and gave me good reasons to believe that Madeleine McCann was well and happy somewhere and could be found. That would be wonderful, but so far, when they join us all they tend to do is end up insulting people, rather than give good reasons for their own opinions. Not helpful!

Agreed. Also I am more interested in `the case` and `justice`. I have tried coming from the perspective of the couple being totally innocent and putting all my prejudices aside, but I`m afraid it just does not ring true. However I don`t agree with every statement that purports their guilt and will say so.


I have never - since following this case in the Mirror forum, through 3As, and now here - seen anybody offer any bit of evidence as to why Madeleine is a) alive, or b) was abducted. The only reasoning that ever seems to be put forward is that Madeleine's not here (so she must have been abducted), and her body hasn't been found (so she must be alive). The reasoning for the McCanns being totally innocent is that they haven't been charged with anything. There may not be the evidence to put anybody in court, but I'm damn certain that the absence of a child, and a lack of forensic evidence, wouldn't be enough in the UK to make the assumption of abduction by a stranger, so why should anybody expect it to in Portugal?


Well said jejune................ I agree that that's it in a nutshell ........ so we therefore have to keep at it........... why should we all assume because a child is missing that she should have been abducted??............

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Re: Trolls

Post  Badboy on Fri 13 Jan - 23:42

THE FACT THAT SOMEONE'S BODY HASN'T BEEN FOUND DOESN'T MEAN THEY ARE ALIVE AS IN THE CASE OF HOFF? A MAFIA GUY WHO DISAPPEARED IN THE 1970?
RECENTLY HIS BODY TURNED UP.

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Re: Trolls

Post  gillyspot on Fri 13 Jan - 23:44

Sadly I can see the Lisa Irwin case progressing just like Madeleine McCann's has.

It would appear if a baby/child disappears from her house as long as no one confesses or a body is found then the case has no other option than to be shelved despite cadaver dogs alerting in both cases.

That is not justice for anyone! IMO

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Re: Trolls

Post  Loopdaloop on Sat 14 Jan - 0:54

Velvet wrote:

Oops thought that poster was a man, my bad!

I agree with you, the behaviour of many of the 'pro's' is appalling, as is some of the so called 'anti's' on other sites. I tend to stay on here now because of that reason. I know because I haven't wrote many posts people may assume I am a 'sleeping troll' but I can assure you that is not the case. I am new to forums and obviously never picked out platinum as someone with malicious intent. Just someone who seemed to know a lot on the case!!

That's strange as in your post history you talk about posting on another forum and a member accusing you of having another alias 'sus' something yet you state that you're new to forums? I agree that you are not a 'sleeping' troll as you are now no longer sleeping.


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Re: Trolls

Post  Velvet on Sat 14 Jan - 9:19

Loopdaloop wrote:
Velvet wrote:

Oops thought that poster was a man, my bad!

I agree with you, the behaviour of many of the 'pro's' is appalling, as is some of the so called 'anti's' on other sites. I tend to stay on here now because of that reason. I know because I haven't wrote many posts people may assume I am a 'sleeping troll' but I can assure you that is not the case. I am new to forums and obviously never picked out platinum as someone with malicious intent. Just someone who seemed to know a lot on the case!!

That's strange as in your post history you talk about posting on another forum and a member accusing you of having another alias 'sus' something yet you state that you're new to forums? I agree that you are not a 'sleeping' troll as you are now no longer sleeping.


That was on THIS forum, you clearly are not reading what was written correctly as I have stated and have no reason to lie that I have not joined any other forum. Firstly the conversation took place on Madeleine official fb page, it was nothing about me being Susible, if you read it correctly you will see it was actually ME who brought Susible up in the conversation. Not very bright of me if i am apparently that person too.

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Re: Trolls

Post  Velvet on Sat 14 Jan - 9:38

Loopdaloop wrote:
Velvet wrote:

Oops thought that poster was a man, my bad!

I agree with you, the behaviour of many of the 'pro's' is appalling, as is some of the so called 'anti's' on other sites. I tend to stay on here now because of that reason. I know because I haven't wrote many posts people may assume I am a 'sleeping troll' but I can assure you that is not the case. I am new to forums and obviously never picked out platinum as someone with malicious intent. Just someone who seemed to know a lot on the case!!

That's strange as in your post history you talk about posting on another forum and a member accusing you of having another alias 'sus' something yet you state that you're new to forums? I agree that you are not a 'sleeping' troll as you are now no longer sleeping.


Plus if you look correctly on my past posts I am actually having a conversation with her at one point!! Am I logging out and signing in as her to have a conversation with myself

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Re: Trolls

Post  T4two on Mon 16 Jan - 11:46

HiDeHo wrote:From my point of view, I welcome a discussion with someone of a differing opinion to mine and use their presence as a 'tool'.

I have no time, and ignore getting into discussion with the disruptors. They feed off the attention and manage to change the direction of the thread.

However, it can be very 'telling' about the original topic of the thread involved and, depending upon the agenda of the disruptor, could give an indication as to the importance of the topic.


Some have discussions, and although it may be to intimidate (its typical for them to tell someone their opinions are silly etc) I find them interesting. If they try to negate my opinions, I use that as information as to the importance of the topic and also to second guess my thoughts. If they continue to have validity after they have been challenged then I consider that to 'confirm' that my opinions have credibility.

Something I find interesting, is, if they tend to use an unusual word or they misspell a particular word, a quick 'Google' adding 'madeleine' 'forum' and possibly 'aimoo' (Madeleine forum with several old threads) will bring up any previous comments on forums and highlights another possible ID they have been using.

A little trick, but it keeps them on their toes!

I just googled a disruptor on another forum and found them using the name they used on an old 3A thread in Madeleine Forum and using a reference to a particular person as back then. Curious..

Yes, that sums up the situation succinctly. There are obviously 'touchy' subjects which bring an immediate confrontational response from posters, but I wonder what the point of disrupting a thread is? I mean, take the subject of the dogs as an example. As soon as a subject is mentioned in a post up pops one of the usual suspects in disguise and lets rip with counter arguments which are usually over the top or reflect the 'official' line. Why go to all the trouble of monitoring discussion forums 24/7 in order to disrupt discussion of a certain subject. Just what is achieved by it?

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Re: Trolls

Post  Loopdaloop on Mon 16 Jan - 12:02

T4two wrote:
HiDeHo wrote:From my point of view, I welcome a discussion with someone of a differing opinion to mine and use their presence as a 'tool'.

I have no time, and ignore getting into discussion with the disruptors. They feed off the attention and manage to change the direction of the thread.

However, it can be very 'telling' about the original topic of the thread involved and, depending upon the agenda of the disruptor, could give an indication as to the importance of the topic.


Some have discussions, and although it may be to intimidate (its typical for them to tell someone their opinions are silly etc) I find them interesting. If they try to negate my opinions, I use that as information as to the importance of the topic and also to second guess my thoughts. If they continue to have validity after they have been challenged then I consider that to 'confirm' that my opinions have credibility.

Something I find interesting, is, if they tend to use an unusual word or they misspell a particular word, a quick 'Google' adding 'madeleine' 'forum' and possibly 'aimoo' (Madeleine forum with several old threads) will bring up any previous comments on forums and highlights another possible ID they have been using.

A little trick, but it keeps them on their toes!

I just googled a disruptor on another forum and found them using the name they used on an old 3A thread in Madeleine Forum and using a reference to a particular person as back then. Curious..

Yes, that sums up the situation succinctly. There are obviously 'touchy' subjects which bring an immediate confrontational response from posters, but I wonder what the point of disrupting a thread is? I mean, take the subject of the dogs as an example. As soon as a subject is mentioned in a post up pops one of the usual suspects in disguise and lets rip with counter arguments which are usually over the top or reflect the 'official' line. Why go to all the trouble of monitoring discussion forums 24/7 in order to disrupt discussion of a certain subject. Just what is achieved by it?

This is the primary paper which all these PR companies have had their work commisoned based upon.
http://warontreason.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/SSRN-id10845851.pdf
Entitled 'Conspiracy Theories' by Cass Sunstein its a call to arms really to get control of the new media of the internets forums and blogs.


Conclusion (from the above link)
Some conspiracy theories create serious risks. They do not merely undermine
democratic debate; in extreme cases, they create or fuel violence. If government can
dispel such theories, it should do so. One problem is that its efforts might be
counterproductive, because efforts to rebut conspiracy theories also legitimate them. We
have suggested, however, that government can minimize this effect by rebutting more
rather than fewer theories, by enlisting independent groups to supply rebuttals, and by
cognitive infiltration designed to break up the crippled epistemology of conspiracyminded groups and informationally isolated social networks.

This was Alex Woolfall's specialist area that he used whilst at Bell Pottinger.




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Re: Trolls

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