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Pat Brown

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Re: Pat Brown

Post  pennylane on Sun 11 Mar - 11:11

kathybelle wrote:
almostgothic wrote:After this latest flurry of stories, I bet Gezza is done with his hair already!

He's probably ripping at his chest wig by now ...


omg.... ouch!!!

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Re: Pat Brown

Post  T4two on Sun 11 Mar - 11:42

If there is some evidence in the vehicle of a body having been on ice, I would be more likely to believe it was literally on ice in the boot. In other words, ice was placed in the boot in a bag or bags as a method of keeping the body cold during transport.

Interesting thoughts on freezing the body, especially as Dr. Amaral states quite clearly that the sample found in the car was consistent with having come from a frozen body. It's interesting that the best way to freeze a body without using a freezer is to use dry ice. Quite common in the food industry and of course the ice-cream trade, it is also commonly used in the medical profession for freezing biological samples for example. Dry ice sublimates, which means it turns from ice to a gas and doesn't go through a liquid stage. It therefore leaves no trace. No need for placing it in any special container then. Any trace found in the car would be from frost occurring on the body caused by moisture in the atmosphere. Because it forms carbon dioxide when it sublimates it is necessary to maintain adequate ventilation - such as driving with the windows down or leaving the boot open when parked? Is dry ice relatively easy to come by in the Luz area?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dry_ice

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Re: Pat Brown

Post  Loopdaloop on Sun 11 Mar - 23:45

matthew wrote:http://patbrownprofiling.blogspot.com/2012/03/criminal-profiling-topic-of-day-find.html

Pat was interested in gerrys phone pings:with thanks to Hideho- http://forum2.aimoo.com/MadeleineMcCann/Where-was-Madeleine-hidden/Strange-Activities-End-July-Beginning-August-1-922085.html

I wish someone could map this pings on google maps / google earth for us!

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Re: Pat Brown

Post  interested on Mon 12 Mar - 0:50

Earlier today (Sunday) Pat tweeted, "...I don't think we are seeing progress; I think we are seeing spin." This was in response to a comment about all the recent articles in newspapers.

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Re: Pat Brown

Post  NoStone on Mon 12 Mar - 7:13

interested wrote:Earlier today (Sunday) Pat tweeted, "...I don't think we are seeing progress; I think we are seeing spin." This was in response to a comment about all the recent articles in newspapers.

In a way she is right - we are not seeing any progress - no interviews, no official re-opening of the case. Hopefully therre is some fact behind the PJ gearing up a new team and wroking with SY. Hopefully there is some fact to the notion that they are following 'new' evidence but as there have been no press statements by the police - the rest can only be spin can it not??

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Re: Pat Brown

Post  pennylane on Mon 12 Mar - 8:03

NoStone wrote:
interested wrote:Earlier today (Sunday) Pat tweeted, "...I don't think we are seeing progress; I think we are seeing spin." This was in response to a comment about all the recent articles in newspapers.

In a way she is right - we are not seeing any progress - no interviews, no official re-opening of the case. Hopefully therre is some fact behind the PJ gearing up a new team and wroking with SY. Hopefully there is some fact to the notion that they are following 'new' evidence but as there have been no press statements by the police - the rest can only be spin can it not??

Goncalo Amaral stated in a recent interview that the police were no longer looking at the pseudo sightings, and that the thing wasn't looking good for the McCanns. That sounds an awful lot like progress!

But the stuff we have read in the UK press is most likely the usual McSpin!

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Re: Pat Brown

Post  Keela on Mon 12 Mar - 15:29

T4two wrote:
If there is some evidence in the vehicle of a body having been on ice, I would be more likely to believe it was literally on ice in the boot. In other words, ice was placed in the boot in a bag or bags as a method of keeping the body cold during transport.

Interesting thoughts on freezing the body, especially as Dr. Amaral states quite clearly that the sample found in the car was consistent with having come from a frozen body. It's interesting that the best way to freeze a body without using a freezer is to use dry ice. Quite common in the food industry and of course the ice-cream trade, it is also commonly used in the medical profession for freezing biological samples for example. Dry ice sublimates, which means it turns from ice to a gas and doesn't go through a liquid stage. It therefore leaves no trace. No need for placing it in any special container then. Any trace found in the car would be from frost occurring on the body caused by moisture in the atmosphere. Because it forms carbon dioxide when it sublimates it is necessary to maintain adequate ventilation - such as driving with the windows down or leaving the boot open when parked? Is dry ice relatively easy to come by in the Luz area?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dry_ice



I don't know anywhere in the Algarve where you can readily buy dry ice, let alone in the PDL area.

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Re: Pat Brown

Post  LJC on Mon 12 Mar - 23:20

Did anybody have a cool box? That would be a good way of initially chilling down until a more permanent cold storage was located.

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Re: Pat Brown

Post  marxman on Tue 13 Mar - 8:48

LJC wrote:Did anybody have a cool box? That would be a good way of initially chilling down until a more permanent cold storage was located.

Maybe the 'blue bag' was used as a DIY cooler?
I'm sure with their medical know-how and of
items available it could be done.

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Re: Pat Brown

Post  tigger on Tue 13 Mar - 9:25

T4two wrote:
If there is some evidence in the vehicle of a body having been on ice, I would be more likely to believe it was literally on ice in the boot. In other words, ice was placed in the boot in a bag or bags as a method of keeping the body cold during transport.

Interesting thoughts on freezing the body, especially as Dr. Amaral states quite clearly that the sample found in the car was consistent with having come from a frozen body. It's interesting that the best way to freeze a body without using a freezer is to use dry ice. Quite common in the food industry and of course the ice-cream trade, it is also commonly used in the medical profession for freezing biological samples for example. Dry ice sublimates, which means it turns from ice to a gas and doesn't go through a liquid stage. It therefore leaves no trace. No need for placing it in any special container then. Any trace found in the car would be from frost occurring on the body caused by moisture in the atmosphere. Because it forms carbon dioxide when it sublimates it is necessary to maintain adequate ventilation - such as driving with the windows down or leaving the boot open when parked? Is dry ice relatively easy to come by in the Luz area?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dry_ice

I would have thought a largish freezer would be easier to come by around PdL - along with an unused holiday apartment for which you'd need someone who'd be in charge of such properties - either for sale or rent. Quite possible in the off season - Murat would have been useful here. Plus there was the apartment in Burgau - which I thinks belongs to Murat or Murat's father?
Buying a quantity of dry ice from one of very few suppliers in the area would surely be a far greater risk?

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Totally agree, tigger...

Post  comperedna on Tue 13 Mar - 12:22

tigger wrote:
T4two wrote:
If there is some evidence in the vehicle of a body having been on ice, I would be more likely to believe it was literally on ice in the boot. In other words, ice was placed in the boot in a bag or bags as a method of keeping the body cold during transport.

Interesting thoughts on freezing the body, especially as Dr. Amaral states quite clearly that the sample found in the car was consistent with having come from a frozen body. It's interesting that the best way to freeze a body without using a freezer is to use dry ice. Quite common in the food industry and of course the ice-cream trade, it is also commonly used in the medical profession for freezing biological samples for example. Dry ice sublimates, which means it turns from ice to a gas and doesn't go through a liquid stage. It therefore leaves no trace. No need for placing it in any special container then. Any trace found in the car would be from frost occurring on the body caused by moisture in the atmosphere. Because it forms carbon dioxide when it sublimates it is necessary to maintain adequate ventilation - such as driving with the windows down or leaving the boot open when parked? Is dry ice relatively easy to come by in the Luz area?


A chest freezer is an amazingly common item. You would surely find one in many or most apartments or houses. A freezer, or more commonly a mortuary fridge is what doctors do with bodies routinely in hospital. So simple... a not all that big parcel, tightly wrapped, or in the bag, and covered up (sorry if you think its tasteless) with packs of frozen peas and the like. By far the simplest solution. Could stay there for ages... until it was expedient to move it for permanent disposal... by which I mean getting rid of it completely, by whichever means you think most likely... or of course there could have been an abduction... hmmmmm...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dry_ice

I would have thought a largish freezer would be easier to come by around PdL - along with an unused holiday apartment for which you'd need someone who'd be in charge of such properties - either for sale or rent. Quite possible in the off season - Murat would have been useful here. Plus there was the apartment in Burgau - which I thinks belongs to Murat or Murat's father?
Buying a quantity of dry ice from one of very few suppliers in the area would surely be a far greater risk?

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Re: Pat Brown

Post  interested on Tue 13 Mar - 19:52

Thinking about freezers remind me someone on the old Mirror forum mentioned that there was a large commercial type freezer in one of the two restaurants located close to the beach. I had almost forgotten about that comment because it would have been close to five years ago but came back to me as I read the foregoing comments.

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Re: Pat Brown

Post  Keela on Wed 14 Mar - 15:20

interested wrote:Thinking about freezers remind me someone on the old Mirror forum mentioned that there was a large commercial type freezer in one of the two restaurants located close to the beach. I had almost forgotten about that comment because it would have been close to five years ago but came back to me as I read the foregoing comments.


I don't think this idea is a goer. Can you really see anyone approaching the restaurant and asking if they could just store this package in their freezer? No I don't either.

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Re: Pat Brown

Post  interested on Wed 14 Mar - 17:28

Keela wrote:
interested wrote:Thinking about freezers remind me someone on the old Mirror forum mentioned that there was a large commercial type freezer in one of the two restaurants located close to the beach. I had almost forgotten about that comment because it would have been close to five years ago but came back to me as I read the foregoing comments.


I don't think this idea is a goer. Can you really see anyone approaching the restaurant and asking if they could just store this package in their freezer? No I don't either.

Point well taken. There was further discussion on the Mirror forum that Murat was an acquaintance of the owner of the eating establishment and "temporary arrangements" could have been made. These comments were made around the time that Gerry refused to say whether he knew Murat, which of course heightened suspicions of a conspiracy.

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Re: Pat Brown

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