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Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

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Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  Wintabells on Mon 28 Oct - 8:32

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2478087/Why-Maddie-suspect-E-fits-kept-secret-years-Images-evidence-sighting-uncovered-private-detectives-suppressed.html

Why were Maddie suspect E-fits kept secret for five years? Images and evidence of sighting uncovered by private detectives were suppressed

Images of man seen carrying child through Praia da Luz on the night of Madeleine's disappearance were unveiled on Crimewatch two weeks ago
Based on evidence from Irish holidaymaker Martin Smith and his family
Emerged yesterday that E-fits were contained in files from five years ago
Produced by private investigators hired by the McCanns


By Neil Sears

PUBLISHED: 01:15, 28 October 2013  | UPDATED: 01:15, 28 October 2013    

The E-fits of a ‘new’ suspect for Madeleine McCann’s disappearance were drawn up five years ago – and suppressed.

Images of a man seen carrying a child through Praia da Luz at 10pm on the night the then three-year-old vanished were unveiled on BBC1’s Crimewatch two weeks ago.

They are based on evidence from Irish holidaymaker Martin Smith and his family. At the same time, the British police team behind a new investigation revealed they had discounted a 9.15pm sighting of a man with a child by Jane Tanner, a friend holidaying with parents Gerry and Kate McCann and their three children.

It meant there was a new ‘timeline’ of Madeleine’s presumed abduction. Yet it emerged yesterday that the recently released E-fits were in fact contained in files produced five years ago by private investigators hired by the McCanns. Similarly, those private detectives had questioned the Tanner sighting and the timings associated with it.

But the E-fits were kept private, and the questioning of the Tanner sighting and related timeline were kept quiet. One detective said he was ‘utterly stunned’ to see his five-year-old dossier suddenly presented as new on TV.

The investigator told a Sunday newspaper: ‘I was absolutely stunned when I watched the programme... it most certainly wasn’t a new timeline and it certainly isn’t a new revelation. It is absolute nonsense to suggest either of those things... and those E-fits you saw on Crimewatch are ours.’

The McCanns are now fully behind the fresh police drive and release of the E-fits – but five years ago they were reluctant to issue them, possibly in part because witness Mr Smith’s account seemed inconsistent and unreliable.

Months after the disappearance and after seeing Gerry McCann on TV, Mr Smith told police that he thought the man he saw carrying a girl around Madeleine’s age at the very time she went missing reminded him of Gerry McCann himself.

Mr Smith has reportedly since withdrawn that claim – just as Portuguese police have officially told the McCanns they are no longer suspects for their daughter’s disappearance.

The couple have also won libel damages for false suggestions that they were in any way involved.

Numerous witnesses have also given statements making clear that Mr McCann was at his holiday complex at the moment the sighting occurred – which was at the very time when he and his wife started calling for help looking for Maddie.

But shortly after Mr Smith told police Mr McCann may have been the man he had seen carrying a little girl, a friend of the McCanns said: ‘Look at the facts. This man sees an individual carrying a child on the night Maddie vanished.

‘He waits 13 days to report this to the police, going back to Ireland  in the meantime. At this stage he admits he has no idea who the man is. Almost four months go by before, after seeing him on TV, he feels that it could be Gerry.

‘The truth is that this is part of  the victimisation of Gerry and Kate which has gone on from the very beginning by the Portuguese.’

Portuguese police have officially told Kate and Gerry McCann they are no longer suspects for the disappearance

In 2008, the McCanns used money from their charity fund to hire investigators from a firm called Oakley International, led by  former MI5 surveillance officer Henri Exton, to look into the mystery – and they focused on the Smith sighting.

They produced a dossier and called for the E-fits to be published. They also suggested Madeleine could have died after wandering off.

The McCanns, who became embroiled in an unconnected financial dispute with Oakley International at around the time they received the dossier, responded by warning the detectives of legal action if they publicised their report.

A source close to the fund said the report would have been ‘completely distracting’ if it had become public.

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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  kitti on Mon 28 Oct - 9:11

how can it be victimisation when the papers etc were all fawning over the mccanns

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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  mossman on Mon 28 Oct - 9:19

kitti wrote:how can it be victimisation when the papers etc were all fawning over the mccanns

Why is it victimisation by the Portugese, Mr Smith is Irish ! The "friend" sounds like Auntie Phil or on of those wonderful people to me.

Doesn't matter what Mr Smith said Kate and Gerry. You both hid the files and refused to allow your own investigators follow what could have been valid and fruitful leads to find your daughter. You stopped it. You had a chance to prove Mr Smith was wrong and you chose, as usual, to hide.

I would not like to be Mr Smith at the moment. Poor man, he only did what he thought was right and now he is stuck in the middle of those two heartless people and all they stand for.


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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  fuzeta on Mon 28 Oct - 9:26

The fact is though that it was Leicestershire police that Martin Smith reported this to first, not Oakley. Or is it me having a senior moment?

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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  almostgothic on Mon 28 Oct - 9:39

‘The truth is that this is part of  the victimisation of Gerry and Kate which has gone on from the very beginning by the Portuguese.’


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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  tanszi on Mon 28 Oct - 9:49

well the Portuguese didn't make them suppress the e fit, and the Portuguese are not responsible for the children being left, the McCs are. whatever it doesn't go down well that they suppressed this information for five years. Oh be careful what you ask for because you may just get it. I wonder if there is anything else anywhere which is being suppressed by the McCs.

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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  mara thon on Mon 28 Oct - 9:54

'victimisation'!........if anyone was victimised it was the Portuguese, Kate and Gerry certainly were not victimised, money thrown at them, feted by the rich and famous, protected by the very highest authorities, completely untouchable.

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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  pennylane on Mon 28 Oct - 9:59

'Yet it emerged yesterday that the recently released E-fits were in fact contained in files produced five years ago by private investigators hired by the McCanns. Similarly, those private detectives had questioned the Tanner sighting and the timings associated with it.'

They were doing their job professionally.... how refreshing for this case!  They probably knew the score immediately from the McCanns reactions.  I wonder if others will be contacting these ex-MI5 agents.... apart from Carter Ruck that is!

Operation Grange take note:  The evidence points one way only.... when you haven't got a dodgy agenda.

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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  mossman on Mon 28 Oct - 10:01

tanszi wrote:well the Portuguese didn't make them suppress the e fit, and the Portuguese are not responsible for the children being left, the McCs are.  whatever it doesn't go down well that they suppressed this information for five years.  Oh be careful what you ask for because you may just get it.  I wonder if there is anything else anywhere which is being suppressed by the McCs.

Tanszi, they have suppressed the truth from day one.

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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  cass on Mon 28 Oct - 10:27

mossman wrote:
tanszi wrote:well the Portuguese didn't make them suppress the e fit, and the Portuguese are not responsible for the children being left, the McCs are.  whatever it doesn't go down well that they suppressed this information for five years.  Oh be careful what you ask for because you may just get it.  I wonder if there is anything else anywhere which is being suppressed by the McCs.
Tanszi, they have suppressed the truth from day one.  
just makes me shudder what else we dont know - what the hell went off on that holiday for so many people wanting to hide stuff like this poor madeleine

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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  kitti on Mon 28 Oct - 10:29

They paid their mortgage off.....that crept out...


Hot lips Healy ....that crept out..



There is PLENTY more....



I'm waiting for the 'damp squid Gerry'...

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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  Panda on Mon 28 Oct - 10:47

kitti wrote:They paid their mortgage  off.....that crept out...


Hot lips Healy ....that crept out..



There is PLENTY more....



I'm waiting for the 'damp squid Gerry'...

Morning Iris, I read that they had changed their Mortgage from Northern Rock to HSBc and there was well over £300,000 owing on it. If they have paid off the Mortgage from the Fund Account that is Fraud and even though it is a Private Company any Donor can make a complaint.

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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  frencheuropean on Mon 28 Oct - 12:08


One comment with 1156 green arrows:


GeoffCapesBudgie, London, United Kingdom, 9 hours ago

"And so, finally, the British press begins to ask the right questions."..


ReplyNew

55 ( red arrows)

1156 ( green arrows)

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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  Panda on Mon 28 Oct - 12:18

frencheuropean wrote:
One comment with 1156 green arrows:


GeoffCapesBudgie, London, United Kingdom, 9 hours ago

"And so, finally, the British press begins to ask the right questions."..


ReplyNew

55 ( red arrows)

1156 ( green arrows)
Thanks frenchperson, maybe the walls of Jericho are finally starting to crumble. 

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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  Guest on Mon 28 Oct - 12:35

There is one reply to that, full of the usual bollox. "Poor McCanns made a mistake, useless Portuguese plods, you are all nutters and haters" sort of thing. To date, it has attracted 300 red arrows. I think the McCanns will have a hard time explaining this latest "mistake".

Also, is there some sort of subliminal message in the two photographs used?


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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  widowan on Mon 28 Oct - 14:06

almostgothic wrote:‘The truth is that this is part of  the victimisation of Gerry and Kate which has gone on from the very beginning by the Portuguese.’

Poor victims, it would be distracting because the report was hyper critical - of THEM - and found gross anomalies in their statements.

You don't have to be from MI5 to see that. I just watched THEIR OWN reconstruction and then compared it to the account BY KATE in her book and they don't match. Gerry says on Panorama, like Matt he never put his head in. She says he went in, stood over Madeleine and thought how beautiful she was.

THey make their own troubles.


Last edited by widowan on Mon 28 Oct - 14:18; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  LJC on Mon 28 Oct - 14:16

It was reported by the Irish Police that Mr Smith was upset on the phone when he thought he should tell them the man looked like Gerry and the Irish Police said Mr Smith was not the kind of person who wanted any limelight and in their opinion was genuine.

If the McCanns own PI's came to the same conclusion as the PJ, that this sighting needed further investigation, then the McCanns should have co-operated.

Trouble with the McCanns is right from the start they have wanted to direct proceedings also.

At least we all know now why Mr Amaral was shunted sideways. If the PJ wanted to victimise the McCanns they would have kept Mr Amaral in his role and allowed him to investigate this lead but the powers that be deemed the Smith sighting unreliable also it seems and would not take it any further and shelved the case.

However, the PI's are not the PJ, are receiving money for their services, are acting in the interests of their Clients the McCanns and if they felt it was worth pursuing after all, leaving no stone unturned, the McCanns should have allowed it.

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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  widowan on Mon 28 Oct - 14:22

LJC wrote:It was reported by the Irish Police that Mr Smith was upset on the phone when he thought he should tell them the man looked like Gerry and the Irish Police said Mr Smith was not the kind of person who wanted any limelight and in their opinion was genuine.

If the McCanns own PI's came to the same conclusion as the PJ, that this sighting needed further investigation, then the McCanns should have co-operated.

Trouble with the McCanns is right from the start they have wanted to direct proceedings also.

At least we all know now why Mr Amaral was shunted sideways.  If the PJ wanted to victimise the McCanns they would have kept Mr Amaral in his role and allowed him to investigate this lead but the powers that be deemed the Smith sighting unreliable also it seems and would not take it any further and shelved the case.

However, the PI's are not the PJ, are receiving money for their services, are acting in the interests of their Clients the McCanns and if they felt it was worth pursuing after all, leaving no stone unturned, the McCanns should have allowed it.
After phase two of the investigation by Oakley however Kate tells us due to something about their feedback the relationship became acrimonious and they decided not to continue with Oakley. this had nothing to do with the fraud thing Halligen was later embroiled in and Kate says she felt the investigators were doing a good job - sadly unpaid and then suppressed in the case of Exton's team.

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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  pennylane on Mon 28 Oct - 14:25

Iris wrote:There is one reply to that, full of the usual bollox.  "Poor McCanns made a mistake, useless Portuguese plods, you are all nutters and haters" sort of thing.  To date, it has attracted 300 red arrows.  I think the McCanns will have a hard time explaining this latest "mistake".

Also, is there some sort of subliminal message in the two photographs used?

omg you're right, Iris. It's the infamous cardiologist without a doubt!

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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  LJC on Mon 28 Oct - 14:42

If Mr Martin Smith had a vendetta against the McCanns, deliberately saying the man he saw looked like Gerry for vengeful reasons, I am sure SY would have had him prosecuted by now for harassment of the McCanns or for perverting the course of justice. Even wasting police time. But no, this has not happened. Mr Smith must be sick and tired by now and wishing he had never been in PDL that fateful night.

It may indeed be unreliable to say in one statement he could not identify the man again and in the next to say he could, but Mr Smith did not do this out of resentment for the McCanns; he did it to try and help the enquiry.

Whether he was persuaded it was Gerry because of all the other factors coming to light from PDL which pointed to the parents we may never know but I feel sure he had a genuinely held belief that the man he saw strongly resembled Gerry in his height, build, weight, hair colour etc and he felt compelled to tell police what he felt

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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  widowan on Mon 28 Oct - 14:45

LJC wrote:If Mr Martin Smith had a vendetta against the McCanns, deliberately saying the man he saw looked like Gerry for vengeful reasons, I am sure SY would have had him prosecuted by now for harassment of the McCanns or for perverting the course of justice.  Even wasting police time.  But no, this has not happened.  Mr Smith must be sick and tired by now and wishing he had never been in PDL that fateful night.

It may indeed be unreliable to say in one statement he could not identify the man again and in the next to say he could, but Mr Smith did not do this out of resentment for the McCanns; he did it to try and help the enquiry.

Whether he was persuaded it was Gerry because of all the other factors coming to light from PDL which pointed to the parents we may never know but I feel sure he had a genuinely held belief that the man he saw strongly resembled Gerry in his height, build, weight, hair colour etc and he felt compelled to tell police what he felt
I feel sure that if SMith - like all of us being asked to remember any single thing you might have noticed no matter how small - had noticed someone carrying a child who did NOT resemble Gerry and Smith failed to phone THAT in, they would have had a big issue with him - after all look what happened because whoever Bundleman turned out to be did not come forward.

The objection was that it proved a "distraction" because the guy looked like Gerry.  So guys who are 35-45 and have short brown hair and a Scots look about them can't be perverts or should get a pass, in case it proves distracting?


Last edited by widowan on Mon 28 Oct - 16:08; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  pennylane on Mon 28 Oct - 14:57

Goncalo Amaral said in an interview that Jane put Bundleman in similar attire to Smithman. I wish I could find that darn interview, I've looked everywhere for it.  It must have had subtitles or I wouldn't have known what he was saying.  I remember this much..... he said 'it was genius.'  

Anyone know where I can find it? GA was being interviewed with another man re the Maddie case.

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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  Annabel on Mon 28 Oct - 15:14

From Twitter:


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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  pennylane on Mon 28 Oct - 15:16

Annabel wrote:From Twitter:

   

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Re: Daily Mail - Why were E-fits kept secret?

Post  widowan on Mon 28 Oct - 15:23

pennylane wrote:Goncalo Amaral said in an interview that Jane put Bundleman in similar attire to Smithman.  I wish I could find that darn interview, I've looked everywhere for it.  It must have had subtitles or I wouldn't have known what he was saying.  I remember this much..... he said 'it was genius.'  

Anyone know where I can find it? GA was being interviewed with another man re the Maddie case.
Don't know but both were wearing chinos or tan colored pants. Not sure how uncommon that is for tourists in Portugal but khaki pants are very common in the US as well as jeans. If I wanted to put someone in a pair of pants, and had not seen the person, I would think either jeans or khakis would be the way to go.

I recall something about the trousers having buttons on. Odd for man's pants. You would notice that - a row of buttons? Is that like cargo pants with the buttons that close the pockets on the leg?

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