Cliff owning an apartment in Ocean Club?

There seems to be a debate on FB that Cliff Richard owns(ed) an apartment near to the Tapas bar, I know he has a vineyard near to Albufeira, but this is the first time I have heard any rumuors of this. Any of you lot heard?

wait till cherry swings by. she's the expert on all things cliff.

Interesting use of words Marky



Fred I have only seen it mentioned on facebook recently but not heard of this before and haven't seen anything as yet to
substantiate it. As far as I know its just the villa he had with the vineyard. x

Right! Me too! Seems to be another pile of shoite rumours!

could well be unless someone comes up with something to substantiate it

don't hold ya noses.

My dentist is friendly with Cliff and is not fooled by the McCann fairy stories. If I remember when I see him next month. I will ask if he knows.

People seem determined to discredit him one way or another.

His younger sister has just died of cancer and the Daily Mail couldn't even report this without mentioning the sex allegations.

saloongirl wrote:People seem determined to discredit him one way or another.

His younger sister has just died of cancer and the Daily Mail couldn't even report this without mentioning the sex allegations.

it won't ever go away gal. the 'no smoke without fire' nazis won't let it.

Marky wrote:

saloongirl wrote:People seem determined to discredit him one way or another.

His younger sister has just died of cancer and the Daily Mail couldn't even report this without mentioning the sex allegations.

it won't ever go away gal. the 'no smoke without fire' nazis won't let it.

Or even the people who believe in "them not getting away with it" nazis won't let it drop. It's a shame that a huge majority of people knew about Saville, but hey he was a nice guy, just like Cliff is, so let him off and don't mention it. Poor kids who have had their arses shagged off by these people are less than nothing. Hey ho, mummy and daddy are dead we are in care, so let the "devil" in charge fuck us up the arse, they are being paid to protect us so no one will believe us, and no they didn't. Look at the "care" place in Jersey, hey, no it wasn't childrens bones, it was a coconut shell. Fuck me if anyone believes that, then my God.

Well Fred that's certainly putting it how it often is

Sexual abuse claims are very serious and should always, always be investigated to the fullest extent, particularly when children or young people are concerned. That said, the 'guilty until proven innocent/where there's smoke there's fire/alleged victims never lie' mentality is very dangerous.

I would say in general victims who have been abused as children do not normally lie about it and victims not being believed is dangerous as that is what lets the abusers get away with it as we have already seen.

cherry1 wrote:I would say in general victims who have been abused as children do not normally lie about it and victims not being believed is dangerous as that is what lets the abusers get away with it as we have already seen.

In Child Protection training, people are always taught to accept what the child is saying. Listen. Don't ask questions to elicit more information, but the child must be told that you will be passing on the information to someone who deals with these issues. Most important is to start by believing the child because very few children make up stories of abuse and they must be told that you are taking what they say seriously.

Exactly

cherry1 wrote:Exactly

Yep!

Nobody, certainly not me, has actually said that the claims shouldn't have been investigated or taken seriously.

There are countless cases of people wrongly accused and wrongly convicted who were, themselves, victims of the 'there's no smoke without fire' mentality. That's why it's so important that allegations are investigated by honest, competent, unbiased professionals. And those professionals certainly don't agree with such generalizing statements. One thing is to investigate all there is to investigate. Another, completely different, is to be unprofessional and prejudiced about it. Alleged victims have to be given a voice and be taken seriously at all times. That, however, doesn't mean taking their word for granted without investigating thoroughly as so many miscarriages of justice prove.

Claudia79 wrote:There are countless cases of people wrongly accused and wrongly convicted who were, themselves, victims of the 'there's no smoke without fire' mentality. That's why it's so important that allegations are investigated by honest, competent, unbiased professionals. And those professionals certainly don't agree with such generalizing statements. One thing is to investigate all there is to investigate. Another, completely different, is to be unprofessional and prejudiced about it. Alleged victims have to be given a voice and be taken seriously at all times. That, however, doesn't mean taking their word for granted without investigating thoroughly as so many miscarriages of justice prove.

still alive huh.

fred wrote:

Marky wrote:

saloongirl wrote:People seem determined to discredit him one way or another.

His younger sister has just died of cancer and the Daily Mail couldn't even report this without mentioning the sex allegations.

it won't ever go away gal. the 'no smoke without fire' nazis won't let it.

Or even the people who believe in "them not getting away with it" nazis won't let it drop.  It's a shame that a huge majority of people knew about Saville, but hey he was a nice guy, just like Cliff is, so let him off and don't mention it.  Poor kids who have had their arses shagged off by these people are less than nothing.  Hey ho, mummy and daddy are dead we are in care, so let the "devil" in charge fuck us up the arse, they are being paid to protect us so no one will believe us, and no they didn't.  Look at the "care" place in Jersey, hey, no it wasn't childrens bones, it was a coconut shell.   Fuck me if anyone believes that, then my God.

were you frothing at the mouth while writing this?

All professionals who are honest and competent and have an understanding of child abuse would agree that victims of child abuse do not normally make it up so you start with the premise of believing the child every time before any investigation is even started. We have seen how time and time again those who have come forward to disclose have not been believed by the people they have turned to for help, often children left with their abusers to be abused again and sadly many of those who have let children down will have got away with it - children's home staff, social workers, medical profession, teachers, police, etc etc.

Victims who have been fighting for justice for years who were not believed must despair when on social media they see the same kind of comments casting doubts on victims. On twitter we have seen so called barrister Barbara Hewson part of the false allegations brigade doing all she can to cast doubt on victims citing a minimum number of 'false allegations' - some of which she includes in that are VIP abusers who got let off - however she doesn't mention the thousands and thousands of kids who were abused in children's homes, SWales children's homes, Jersey, Magdalene Laundries, Kendall House, Elm Guest House, Grafton Close, and countless children's homes in local authorities throughout the UK. She also doesn't mention the children who committed suicide because they were not believed.

Children who disclose abuse must be believed every time, before any investigation is even started. A child has to know she/he is being believed otherwise it is a further abuse of that child.

Marky wrote:

Claudia79 wrote:There are countless cases of people wrongly accused and wrongly convicted who were, themselves, victims of the 'there's no smoke without fire' mentality. That's why it's so important that allegations are investigated by honest, competent, unbiased professionals. And those professionals certainly don't agree with such generalizing statements. One thing is to investigate all there is to investigate. Another, completely different, is to be unprofessional and prejudiced about it. Alleged victims have to be given a voice and be taken seriously at all times. That, however, doesn't mean taking their word for granted without investigating thoroughly as so many miscarriages of justice prove.

still alive huh.

Pretty much.

cherry1 wrote:All professionals who are honest and competent and have an understanding of child abuse would agree that victims of child abuse do not normally make it up so you start with the premise of believing the child every time before any investigation is even started. We have seen how time and time again those who have come forward to disclose have not been believed by the people they have turned to for help, often children left with their abusers to be abused again and sadly many of those who have let children down will have got away with it - children's home staff, social workers, medical profession, teachers, police, etc etc.  

Victims who have been fighting for justice for years who were not believed must despair when on social media they see the same kind of comments casting doubts on victims. On twitter we have seen so called barrister Barbara Hewson part of the false allegations brigade doing all she can to cast doubt on victims citing a minimum number of 'false allegations' - some of which she includes in that are VIP abusers who got let off - however she doesn't mention the thousands and thousands of kids who were abused in children's homes, SWales children's homes, Jersey, Magdalene Laundries, Kendall House, Elm Guest House, Grafton Close, and countless children's homes in local authorities throughout the UK. She also doesn't mention the children who committed suicide because they were not believed.

Children who disclose abuse must be believed every time, before any investigation is even started. A child has to know she/he is being believed otherwise it is a further abuse of that child.

I have done Child Protection training both as a teacher and as a Residential Social Worker, working with children in care and probably the most important part of that training is to accept without question what a child is saying when that child starts to disclose abuse. Always believe and never promise to keep what is said secret.

Believing the testimony of an alleged victim and investigating thoroughly whatever and whoever there is to investigate until absolutely everything is clear is not the same as thinking someone's word is enough. It's not. It can't be. The 'there's no smoke without fire' thing us unscientific, unfair and undemocratic. That's not how democracies apply the law. That's more of a Taliban, Daeshish mentality.