plan to use radar equipment to look underground

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/may/05/madeleine-mccann-portugal-forensics-excavations

Madeleine McCann: UK police travel to Portugal resort to oversee excavations
Report says forensics team plan to use radar equipment to look underground for clues to child's disappearance seven years ago
Share 25


inShare
0
Email
Ben Quinn
theguardian.com, Monday 5 May 2014 01.45 BST
Madeline McCann
Madeleine went missing from her family’s rented holiday apartment in Praia da Luz on 3 May 2007. Photograph: PA
The search for missing child Madeleine McCann is set to enter a new phase as British police prepare to travel to Portugal to oversee excavations in the Portuguese resort where she went missing seven years ago, according to a report.

A team of forensic officers will use radar equipment to look underground for clues to her disappearance, according to a report in the Daily Mirror, which cited police sources.

The child's parents, Kate and Gerry McCann, were said to have been told of the plans to search three sites near the Praia da Lux resort but are not expected to go to Portugal.

Madeleine went missing from her family's rented holiday apartment in Praia da Luz on 3 May 2007, as her parents dined with friends at a nearby tapas bar.

A spokesman for the Metropolitan police said that the force would neither confirm nor deny the report. "We are not going to give a running commentary," he said. "From the beginning of Operation Grange [the UK-led hunt for Madeleine], we have made it clear that speculation has been unhelpful to the investigation and that continues to be the case.

"As we have said from the beginning, we will not be commenting on any speculation surrounding this investigation."

Police said last month that they knew of nine sexual assaults and three "near misses" on British girls between the ages of six and 12 who were on holiday in the Algarve between 2004 and 2006.

Scotland Yard began a review of the case in May 2011 – codenamed Operation Grange – and opened a formal investigation last July.

Five new cases in which young girls were assaulted and one near miss came to light as a result of an appeal in March for information about a lone predator entering rooms of British families on holiday.

The Met said more than 500 people came forward and its officers were cautiously optimistic that they would be soon be working on the ground with Portuguese authorities, who will remain in charge of the investigation despite hopes of a joint operation. Portuguese police last year reopened their investigation after discovering new lines of inquiry.

There is a £20,000 reward for information leading to the arrest and prosecution of those responsible for Madeleine's disappearance. Anyone with information can call police on 0207 321 9251 or Crimestoppers anonymously on 0800 555 111.


And Guardian knows this because.....
....didn't SY just say they don't comment on ongoing investigation.
And what is this anyway? Are they working together with the South African (forgot the name) and dig Murats driveway? Or what? This doesn't make sense.

Weissnicht, this is uncanny !!1 I just posted this on the Paedo thread   

A Poster with a foreign name said Madeleine's body was hidden in a pipe laid a few feet under the earth of ongoing waterworks.'

This was in the Dutch papers today:

" />

Says "in short" that they will be searching near by the holliday appartments in PDL to clues underground.
The Britisch police confirms nor denies that a new investigation is started because speculation could harm the investigation.

[quote="Bebootje"]This was in the Dutch papers today:

" />

Says "in short" that they will be searching near by the holliday appartments in PDL to clues underground.
The Britisch police confirms nor denies that a new investigation is started because speculation could harm the investigation. [QUOTE]

Morning Bebootje, nice to see you posting again......maybe this new search has some credibility since Foreign Newspapers are printing it. What if the post I saw was accurate??? Had the Daily Mirror thought to take the email address of the POSTER and passed it on to either U.K. or Portugese Police this case could have been over years ago.

Pat Brown comment on it:

http://patbrownprofiling.blogspot.co.uk/ :


"Monday, May 5, 2014




Hey, Gerry, Have You Still Got That Shovel for Us to Borrow?






Bollux Media has just learned that DCI Andy Redwood is heading to Praia da Luz to dig up the town and countryside in an effort to find Madeleine who he recently admitted might be dead.

BM: Mr. Redwood, are you now convinced Maddie is no longer alive? That she isn't living happily with a family somewhere, gypsy or otherwise?

AR: ::snorts::Well, come on, we might be daft here at Scotland Yard but we never really believed the child was living the good life somewhere out there.

BM: And you no longer think she could be held in a sex ring?

AR: Well, I guess that could be a theory but we have to wrap this case up....it's been three years already and we have come up with squat...we gotta solve it somehow.

BM: That makes sense. So are you now following the evidence trail? The fact that the cadaver dogs hit in the apartment and in the McCanns hire car and that Madeleine must have died on May 3rd and been taken off and buried?

AR: Hell, no! Good Lord, what an insane idea! For three years we have ignored all the physical and behavioral evidence; we aren't going to start focusing on that now.

BM: Then why are you going to dig up Praia da Luz?



AR: Well, if we want to close this case in the near future, that child needs to be dead and buried. We would have to use the theory of a local pedophile and such a person wouldn't keep a child alive more than a few hours, so that would make Madeleine dead and buried nearby the fellow's house. So, we will focus on the area.



BM. Criminal Profiler Pat Brown has a theory that the cadaver dog evidence is valid and that would mean Maddie's body was moved from Praia da Luz to some other location by Gerry McCann. She believes Maddie might well be buried in an desolate area called Monte do Jose Mestre, the area just west of Praia da Luz where Gerry's phone pinged a number of times. In fact, she went to Portugal herself to analyze the case in person and she located this area right off the main road which is isolated enough to be able to bury a body without anyone noticing. She wrote a detailed description of her findings here.

AR: I don't care what that woman thinks: she's a nutter. We have no intention of reviewing the evidence like she did. We will not be visiting that location. We will just wander around Praia da Luz beaches and road shoulders with our radar machines.

BM: So, you aren't actually going to dig?

AR: Well, Gerry gave us his shovel, but I have heard the residents of Praia da Luz and those pesky local government officials aren't keen on us making a lot of holes in the area, so we may not have a chance to put it to use. We will just go through the motions of looking and then declare Maddie was probably dumped in the ocean.

BM: Okay, well, thanks, Mr. Redwood, for the update. I know you have said that Scotland Yard isn't going to give a running commentary on an open investigation or review or whatever it is, but we appreciate you giving us this interview and I am sure all the other British media outlets appreciate your openness in this matter as well.

AR: Most welcome.


This responsible and accurate report was brought to you by Bollux Media and

Criminal Profiler Pat Brown

May 5, 2014"

The Guardian:

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/may/05/madeleine-mccann-portugal-forensics-excavations




Madeleine McCann: UK police travel to Portugal resort to oversee excavations

Report says forensics team plan to use radar equipment to look underground for clues to child's disappearance seven years ago
Share30


Ben Quinn


theguardian.com, Monday 5 May 2014 01.45 BST



Madeleine went missing from her family’s rented holiday apartment in Praia da Luz on 3 May 2007. Photograph: PA


The search for missing child Madeleine McCann is set to enter a new phase as British police prepare to travel to Portugal to oversee excavations in the Portuguese resort where she went missing seven years ago, according to a report.

A team of forensic officers will use radar equipment to look underground for clues to her disappearance, according to a report in the Daily Mirror, which cited police sources.

The child's parents, Kate and Gerry McCann, were said to have been told of the plans to search three sites near the Praia da Lux resort but are not expected to go to Portugal.

Madeleine went missing from her family's rented holiday apartment in Praia da Luz on 3 May 2007, as her parents dined with friends at a nearby tapas bar.

A spokesman for the Metropolitan police said that the force would neither confirm nor deny the report. "We are not going to give a running commentary," he said. "From the beginning of Operation Grange [the UK-led hunt for Madeleine], we have made it clear that speculation has been unhelpful to the investigation and that continues to be the case.

"As we have said from the beginning, we will not be commenting on any speculation surrounding this investigation."

Police said last month that they knew of nine sexual assaults and three "near misses" on British girls between the ages of six and 12 who were on holiday in the Algarve between 2004 and 2006.

Scotland Yard began a review of the case in May 2011 – codenamed Operation Grange – and opened a formal investigation last July.

Five new cases in which young girls were assaulted and one near miss came to light as a result of an appeal in March for information about a lone predator entering rooms of British families on holiday.

The Met said more than 500 people came forward and its officers were cautiously optimistic that they would be soon be working on the ground with Portuguese authorities, who will remain in charge of the investigation despite hopes of a joint operation. Portuguese police last year reopened their investigation after discovering new lines of inquiry.

There is a £20,000 reward for information leading to the arrest and prosecution of those responsible for Madeleine's disappearance. Anyone with information can call police on 0207 321 9251 or Crimestoppers anonymously on 0800 555 111."

Thanks frenchperson,

She believes Maddie might well be buried in an desolate area called Monte do Jose Mestre, the area just west of Praia da Luz where Gerry's phone pinged a number of times. "



First Iv'e heard of this . I remember ages ago , still in the first year of Madeleine's disappearance the Portugese Prosecutor asking a Judge if the phone evidence could be used in a Trial, the Judge said it was too intrusive.!!!

Who said the judge is going to use phone pings....



The phone pings are in the files for all to see.



Theres nothing stopping the PJ, SY or the MET scrutinising these phone records and using them for their own benefit I.e. Finding out who was where and that includes the mccanns and o'brien .

kitti wrote:Who said the judge is going to use phone pings....



The phone pings are in the files for all to see.



Theres nothing stopping the PJ, SY or the MET scrutinising these phone records and using them for their own benefit I.e. Finding out who was where and that includes the mccanns and o'brien .

kitti, you mean the exact area, who made the call and who received it??? I didn't think they had gone that far . There was one call to Swansea Kate made but that is the only one they couldn't identify at first.I presume when the Prosecutor asked the judge if the phone calls could been used and was refused, there would be legal claims made by those "hacked", as in the News of the World case.

Panda wrote:

kitti wrote:Who said the judge is going to use phone pings....



The phone pings are in the files for all to see.



Theres nothing stopping the PJ, SY or the MET scrutinising these phone records and using them for their own benefit I.e. Finding out who was where and that includes the mccanns and o'brien .

kitti, you mean the exact area, who made the call and who received it??? I didn't think they had gone that far . There was one call to Swansea Kate made but that is the only one they couldn't identify at first.I presume when the Prosecutor asked  the judge if the phone calls could been used and was refused, there would be legal claims made by those "hacked", as in the News of the World case.

Mobile phone analysis
https://missingmadeleine.forumotion.net/t8225-mobile-phone-analysis

wjk wrote:

Panda wrote:

kitti wrote:Who said the judge is going to use phone pings....



The phone pings are in the files for all to see.



Theres nothing stopping the PJ, SY or the MET scrutinising these phone records and using them for their own benefit I.e. Finding out who was where and that includes the mccanns and o'brien .

kitti, you mean the exact area, who made the call and who received it??? I didn't think they had gone that far . There was one call to Swansea Kate made but that is the only one they couldn't identify at first.I presume when the Prosecutor asked  the judge if the phone calls could been used and was refused, there would be legal claims made by those "hacked", as in the News of the World case.

Mobile phone analysis
https://missingmadeleine.forumotion.net/t8225-mobile-phone-analysis

Thanks wjk,,,,what would i do without posters like you.  

The last 4 digits of the phone numbers are blocked in the Formal report and I'm sure even the Portugese or SY Police cannot use them without permission and that's why the Judge turned the Prosecutor down ,,,must have been some incriminating evidence in some of the calls for the Prosecutor
to want to go to Trial.

Panda wrote:
Thanks frenchperson,

She believes Maddie might well be buried in an desolate area called Monte do Jose Mestre, the area just west of Praia da Luz where Gerry's phone pinged a number of times. "



First Iv'e heard of this . I remember ages ago , still in the first year of Madeleine's disappearance the Portugese Prosecutor asking a Judge if the phone evidence could be used in a Trial, the Judge said it was too intrusive.!!!  

Pat Brown was in Portugal a couple of years ago. She brought with her a retired British police officer and they met with Mr. Amaral. She did a report on her blog about her visit and her "belief" about this desolate area and Gerry's phone pings from the same area. The report was posted and discussed on this forum shortly after she returned to the U.S. I recall the report included pictures; sorry, I don't know how to bring it back to this current topic; perhaps others remember seeing it as well.

Video:

http://cmtv.sapo.pt/atualidade/detalhe/scotland-yard-quer-escavacoes-na-praia-da-luz.html

There is this interested..
 
https://missingmadeleine.forumotion.net/t18998-a-theory-of-pat-browns

Criminal Profiling Topic of the Day: Another "Ludicrous" Theory in the Disappearance of Madeleine McCann The Daily Profiler

Criminal Profiler Pat Brown
Monday, October 8, 2007

A short time ago, I made a suggestion that the British police might investigate the McCann's residence (and the residences of friends and family of the McCanns) for the possibility that the body of Madeleine McCann might have been transported into England. Some folk immediately labeled the theory ridiculous, or ludicrous, as the McCanns would say. How, they asked, could the McCanns carry a putrefying and decaying body in a suitcase and get it on and off of an airplane? I understand that this sounds mighty foolish to many who don't work in the field of criminal investigation and profiling and they think Pat Brown is a nutcase par excellence!

Let me clear up a few misconceptions: first of all, it is a theory, not a fact. Secondly, a theory is useful to stimulate investigative avenues not yet thought of that might lead to evidence that would otherwise have been overlooked. Third, offering one theory does not mean it is the only theory or even the best theory. It is far more likely that Madeleine's body is somewhere underground in Portugal or Spain or in the ocean. These are simpler places to bury a body. It may be that the body has just not yet been discovered. This is very often the case; while rumors and theories abound about white slavery and porn rings and sightings are made of the victim all over the world, the body of the poor thing has simply been lying in a ravine for the past few months! Sometimes bodies fall into strange and difficult places or are well-buried for years. Then, one day a jogger trips over the body or a farmer turns over some soil to plant his corn, and, voila! The victim has been found.

Maddy McCann will likely be found in a similar way (unless someone did one heck of a job of hiding her). Whether a child predator took Maddy or the parents did her in, she will probably one day just be found. However, there is nothing wrong with being proactive and trying to find her sooner than later. Therefore, the police should follow all leads and theories. IF they find her sooner, than not all the evidence with the body or within the body will have been destroyed by time and nature.

So, search in Portugal and Spain and any other place one can think of. And, yes, search in England: Maddy just might be there.

Would it really be possible for one of the McCanns to cart the body of their daughter back to England? Yes, absolutely. Because of the climate in Portugal, it is possible that should they have buried Maddy in a shallow grave in a sandy substrate, her body would have mummified. Mummification is a desiccation of the corpse where the fluids drain into the ground and the rest of the body dries up. There is relatively little odor associated with a mummified body.

If this occurred, the body would be easier to transport; it would be lighter and drier and lacking the horrible smell of a corpse. Such a body could easily be placed in a sealed bag and placed in a suitcase. Screening of stowed luggage is not likely to uncover a body inside of a suitcase and when the traveler reaches the other end and goes through customs, they enter the "Have nothing to declare line," and just walk through (unless they exhibit concerning behavior that raises a red flag and launches a search of the luggage). As to the McCanns, I seriously doubt they were searched upon arrival, not with all the press surrounding them and the mass of curious onlookers, reporters, and VIPS lurking about.

IF the McCanns were involved and IF Maddy's body was brought home, when this would have happened is another question. Unfortunately, only those inside the organization would (we hope) know the truth about the McCann's movements. For example, Gerry McCann returned to England on June 19, just four days after an exhaustive search for Madeleine was called off. This search was in an arid, desolate area (the kind of climate which might encourage the mummification of a body) near a town called Odiaxere. A letter from an unknown sender had stated she could be found there in a shallow grave. Four days later, Gerry is on a plane home. I don't know if he took any luggage with him, anything more than a rucksack (which I don't know the size of). He only stayed for the day, purportedly to attend some meetings. He claims he had his wallet stolen while getting money from an ATM and later that evening, the wallet was mailed back to him. A rather peculiar story that I wonder might not be a cover for the reason he was late to his meetings; he ostensibly spent the time calling credit card companies to cancel his credit cards.

If I were the police investigator, I would follow up this lead. I would want to know what luggage Gerry took with him to England. I would try to see if there was any proof to the wallet theft story. I would find out if he had any "alone" time on the trip. I would find out if he made those phone calls to the credit card companies and if he really got money from an ATM. I would find out exactly where he was that day through any evidence of his movements (phone call tracking, receipts, witnesses, etc.). I would want to know if anyone met him, especially anyone who he could have transferred a package from one suitcase to another.

I would check all the McCann trips and look for possibly ways for them to transport a body away from Portugal. And, again, I would look for all possible places within Portugal or neighboring countries as possible places to hide or bury a body. I would check the possibility of a burial at sea.

If I were the Portuguese police, I would be following all leads, even those that lead away from the McCanns. It never hurts to be thorough. The point is to recover Madeleine, dead or alive, and bring justice to those that hurt her. In the end, it doesn't matter which theory is correct (except as an educational tool for future investigations). It only matters that the case is solved.

Criminal Profiler Pat Brown

What wasn't allowed was the tapping of the phones. The info of where and when the phones showed activity were allowed and are in the files.

"wjk" - Thanks for posting that 2007 report from Pat Brown. The one I was referring to was much more recent - a few years ago - possibly 2012. Pat spent I think close to two weeks investigating in Portugal. I know her visit and her "belief" as discussed on this forum.

kitti wrote:Who said the judge is going to use phone pings....



The phone pings are in the files for all to see.



Theres nothing stopping the PJ, SY or the MET scrutinising these phone records and using them for their own benefit I.e. Finding out who was where and that includes the mccanns and o'brien .

Those phone pings are incredibly telling evidence. There's a fascinating thread on MCF dedicated to this topic. It offers extremely compelling evidence that they lied about their movements.

Claudia79 wrote:What wasn't allowed was the tapping of the phones. The info of where and when the phones showed activity were allowed and are in the files.

Didn't I say that earlier Claudia? The Judge told the Prosecutor it would be "too intrusive" to listen to conversations, like Hacking in the U.K for which the News of the World was charged and several big payments made to Celebrities

interested wrote:"wjk" - Thanks for posting that 2007 report from Pat Brown.  The one I was referring to was much more recent - a few years ago - possibly 2012.  Pat spent I think close to two weeks investigating in Portugal.  I know her visit and her "belief" as discussed on this forum.

Maybe on this thread?
https://missingmadeleine.forumotion.net/t18818-pat-brown?highlight=pat+brown

wjk wrote:

interested wrote:"wjk" - Thanks for posting that 2007 report from Pat Brown.  The one I was referring to was much more recent - a few years ago - possibly 2012.  Pat spent I think close to two weeks investigating in Portugal.  I know her visit and her "belief" as discussed on this forum.

Maybe on this thread?
https://missingmadeleine.forumotion.net/t18818-pat-brown?highlight=pat+brown

Yes, thanks to "wjk" - the report from Pat that I mentioned above was posted on Page 34 of that thread by "Annabel" on Sunday, 11 March 2012. Pat's report on Monte do Jose Mestre is entitled: "Find the Body and Prove We Killed Her".

Thanks again "wjk" for your help!!!

when the wests were arrested at 1st they took fred in , rose was given bail i think and they left her in the home while they dig i think , now thats very strange , also they took hindley and brady on the moors many a time , but usually in darkness so the press didnt know , they say the press at the time even had helicopters , now i cannot see portugal wanting their little village subjected to all this , no imo if this is true its all been started well before the press have got hold of the story

Panda wrote:

Claudia79 wrote:What wasn't allowed was the tapping of the phones. The info of where and when the phones showed activity were allowed and are in the files.

Didn't I say that earlier Claudia? The Judge told the Prosecutor it would be "too intrusive" to listen to conversations, like Hacking in the U.K for which the News of the World was charged and several big payments made to Celebrities

You said:

First Iv'e heard of this . I remember ages ago , still in the first year of Madeleine's disappearance the Portugese Prosecutor asking a Judge if the phone evidence could be used in a Trial, the Judge said it was too intrusive.!!! wrote:

Phone evidence includes the pings. I wanted to make things as clear as possible. There are enough myths out there.

Claudia79 wrote:

Panda wrote:

Claudia79 wrote:What wasn't allowed was the tapping of the phones. The info of where and when the phones showed activity were allowed and are in the files.

Didn't I say that earlier Claudia? The Judge told the Prosecutor it would be "too intrusive" to listen to conversations, like Hacking in the U.K for which the News of the World was charged and several big payments made to Celebrities

You said:



Phone evidence includes the pings. I wanted to make things as clear as possible. There are enough myths out there.

Thanks Claudia.

interested wrote:

wjk wrote:

interested wrote:"wjk" - Thanks for posting that 2007 report from Pat Brown.  The one I was referring to was much more recent - a few years ago - possibly 2012.  Pat spent I think close to two weeks investigating in Portugal.  I know her visit and her "belief" as discussed on this forum.

Maybe on this thread?
https://missingmadeleine.forumotion.net/t18818-pat-brown?highlight=pat+brown

Yes, thanks to "wjk" - the report from Pat that I mentioned above was posted on Page 34 of that thread by "Annabel" on Sunday, 11 March 2012.  Pat's report on Monte do Jose Mestre is entitled: "Find the Body and Prove We Killed Her".

Thanks again "wjk" for your help!!!

You're welcome, interested   

dazedandconfused wrote:

Claudia79 wrote:

Panda wrote:

Claudia79 wrote:What wasn't allowed was the tapping of the phones. The info of where and when the phones showed activity were allowed and are in the files.

Didn't I say that earlier Claudia? The Judge told the Prosecutor it would be "too intrusive" to listen to conversations, like Hacking in the U.K for which the News of the World was charged and several big payments made to Celebrities

You said:



Phone evidence includes the pings. I wanted to make things as clear as possible. There are enough myths out there.

Thanks Claudia.

You are very welcome, d&c.