Unless it is Re-opened, with the co-operation of the PJ, it is Meaningless

Saturday, May 28, 2011

Met Police will carry out a review of Madeleine McCann Case but why prior to this were the Portuguese authorities not onboard?




Dear All

Through the Holyrood election and in the English local Council elections the Tories ran with a slogan which simply said ‘commonsense’.

Everything was commonsense this and commonsense that.

When David Cameron said that Met Police were going to review the Madeleine McCann and throw £3.5 million at it, I thought that was strange.

It is strange because for all the talk of a review, no one is using the pertinent word in this case; re-open.

And unless it is re-opened, with the co-operation of the Portuguese Judiciary Police (PJ), it is meaningless.

When Cameron popped up and made the announcement, I would have thought that prior to this, that there was already some kind of agreement in place between the British and Portuguese authorities.

And it turns out there isn’t!

This has lead to the Portuguese stating:

“the English need authorization from the Portuguese authorities to investigate in our country, because they do not have competence to act in Portugal”.

So, out of jurisdiction and no co-operation lined up, this isn’t a serious investigation because right from the start it is flawed.

Some high-ranking officers of the British police have equally criticised this decision, arguing that the money that is to be spent is more necessary for other cases.

Lord Harris, a member of the Metropolitan Police states:

"It again embroils their officers in a high-profile investigation, where the chances of success are unclear, and which will divert limited investigative resources away from other matters."

To pull 30 frontline detectives offline and spend million pounds when the necessary prior work to ensure a proper investigation can be done is a complete farce.

This all came about after Kate and Gerry McCann, sent a letter to David Cameron, in which they asked for a review of the case.

'Dear Prime Minister,

As a devoted father and family man, you know the importance of children. Our beloved eldest child, Madeleine, was abducted from Praia da Luz, Portugal, four years ago. Since then, we have devoted all our energies to ensuring her safe return.

Today we are asking you - and the British and Portuguese governments - to help find Madeleine and bring her back to her loving family.

We live in hope that Madeleine will be found alive and returned to us. One call might be all that is needed to lead to Madeleine and her abductor.

To this end, we are seeking a joint INDEPENDENT, TRANSPARENT and COMPREHENSIVE review of ALL information held in relation to Madeleine's disappearance. Thus far, there has been NO formal review of the material held by the police authorities - which is routine practice in most major unsolved crimes.

It is not right that a young vulnerable British citizen has essentially been given up on. This remains an unsolved case of a missing child. Children are our most precious gift.

Please don't give up on Madeleine.

Kate & Gerry McCann'

And with that Cameron was sucked into the McCann Circus along with 30 detectives and £3.5 million pounds.

Such a move makes Cameron a hostage to fortune when the next high profile case comes along and he turns it down.

Contrary to the general feelings within the PJ, Pedro do Carmo, joint national director at the Judiciary Police, cited by “I” newspaper, states that the PJ is available to cooperate in this case, and committed to finding out the “credible, consistent and relevant factors that may contribute to clarify what happened to Madeleine McCann”.

In that case, issues surround her parents as arguidos will come up again.

According to members of the PJ, the review of the Madeleine McCann case questions the professionalism of their officers, who did everything that was possible to solve the child’s disappearance.

Sources recall that, despite them having good criminal investigation labs, a political decision was made to have the tests carried out in English labs.

The source said:

“We let the English do everything that they want.”

Because of various political influences which was due to the missing child’s parents’ social and political status.

That means Gordon Brown and the Labour Government who looking for a feel good factor to boost Brown’s popularity became a problem in the investigation.

The Judiciary Police had already been warned that the Scotland Yard had the intention to analyse the case again.

This does not mean, however, that the criminal process, which is under the Public Ministry’s tutelage, will be reopened.

This process may be picked up again if new evidence that contribute to the investigation’s development are discovered.

Another problem is that some of the officers that are involved in the investigation into the disappearance of Maddie McCann, four years ago in Praia da Luz, are close to retirement or about to present a voluntary leave.

And this will cause the Met Police no end of trouble because the documents are nearly all in Portuguese and it would be better that these people were available.

It is no surprise that the McCann’s four years down the line and with a book to promote have written publicly to David Cameron.They are quite good at manipulating the media; however at anything during the time when the case was archived they could have asked the Portuguese authorities to re-open it.

They didn’t and still haven’t because they can’t control or direct a re-opened investigation.

And still there is no justice for Madeleine McCann, just considerable number of questions which remain unanswered.
disappeare
Kate McCann is alleged to have said “the kidnapper” who seized Madeleine may also have drugged her other two children.

If she thought they were drugged, why didn’t she taken them to hospital on the night Madeleine d to get checked?

Yours sincerely

George Laird
The Campaign for human Rights at Glasgow University

http://glasgowunihumanrights.blogspot.com/


Well said George Laird

Good on you George

Laird is right, of course.
But I would like to believe that Cameron is not stupid. I would like to believe that maybe the letter of the McCanns was this good opportunity to have a new look at the case.
The McCanns were able to reopen the case, but then they should participate in a reconstruction. And they didn't want that and still don't. If the cooperation of PJ implies that the McCanns should participate in a reconstruction they now can hardly refuse. What would that make them look like?

It all sounds sensible to me.

If the case were to be reopened the McCann's couldn't control it.

The point about the children may have been drugged the day b4 just shows Kate up for what she is...she doesn't seem to really care for her children and hasn't a clue about being a doctor.

If this review hasn't got the blessing of the Portuguese PJ then it's like playing solitaire, just a time-wasting exercise.

Here's another question...will the review interview members of the FSS? Why should they change their story on the results? Whenever something smells, evidence is removed / lost. The FSS will be closed down soon.

I really don't think the review is going anywhere.

Sources recall that, despite them having good criminal investigation labs, a political decision was made to have the tests carried out in English labs.

The source said:

“We let the English do everything that they want.”

I remember reading that the Portugese forensics was not considered as advanced as FSS and since the DNA evidence was so fragile it was decided to
use FSS. However , the FSS report was not conclusive and in fact they apparently destroyed the samples because the Portugese did not ask for their
return.!!!!!!

another report stated that FSS was very slow and the Portugese Police did a little experiment. they sent a sample to FSS and a few days later another
sample to their own forensic Dep. The Report on the Portugese Sample was finished and sent to the Police in two weeks, FSS took almost two
months........no wonder the Service has been sold to America.

Thank you Autume
George, great letter I hope you have sent a copy to Mr Cameron.

Imo Cameron is more clued up then Brown was, Cameron just like the majority of the UK is fed up of the McCanns going on and on and on, when in fact it was their chioce to leave their children, not the LP, PJ, Mr Amaral, Gordon Brown, Teressa May or David Cameron, if this is a cover up then why would he give £3.5M of tax payers money for them to come back and say there is no proof the McCanns are involved with their childs disapperance, so you've all got to stop discussing this case, it just isnt going to work,
We know that something isnt quite right and we are not privvy to everything that the Governments know? also could Cameron and May and the vast majority of the UK put up with having to listen to them saying.... see we told you so New Soctland Yard said we are innocent, now can we have some more money for our fund to search for Maddy because we are innocent....oh and by the way we are suing both police forces for damaging our reputations.

I dont think so, this will not work because there is more and more people questioning them because the McCanns will simply not shut up, and Cameron/NSY covering this review up will only make this situation worse imo
I can't see Cameron taking any chances when too many of his voters are now questioning the McCanns and their friends and are not prepared to put up with this charade any longer, Cameron hasn't got where he is today by been taken in with the likes of Kate and Gerry and co.

Lillyofthevalley wrote:Thank you Autume
George, great letter I hope you have sent a copy to Mr Cameron.

Imo Cameron is more clued up then Brown was, Cameron just like the majority of the UK is fed up of the McCanns going on and on and on, when in fact it was their chioce to leave their children, not the LP, PJ, Mr Amaral, Gordon Brown, Teressa May or David Cameron, if this is a cover up then why would he give £3.5M of tax payers money for them to come back and say there is no proof the McCanns are involved with their childs disapperance.
We know that something isnt quite right and we are not privvy to everything that the Governments know? also could Cameron and May and the vast majority of the UK put up with having to listen to them saying.... see we told you so New Soctland Yard said we are innocent, now can we have some more money for our fund to search for Maddy because we are innocent....oh and by the way we are suing both police forces for damaging our reputations.

I dont think so.....
I can't see Cameron taking any chances when too many of his voters are now seriously questioning the McCanns and their friends and are not prepared to put up with this charade any longer.

I'm not convinced Cameron has any idea how many people are questioning the McCanns' version of events. I doubt very much he has time to read forums, or even the interest to do so. Any letters probably get dealt with by a junior member of staff.

Angelina I have 4 letters from David Davies our conservative MP, I'm sure Cameron is fully aware of the "nutters" and the feeling of the majority of his UK voters, is he really prepared to spend £3.5m of tax payers money on "reviewing" evidence regarding two child neglectors, who will not shut up,who come out of this unscaved, imo it will just fuel the McCanns fire, a fire that is very critical of the UK Government, especially Ms May, someone had to step in and stop it, and that person had to be David Cameron.

Time will tell.

Lillyofthevalley wrote:Angelina I have 4 letters from David Davies our conservative MP, I'm sure Cameron is fully aware of the "nutters" and the feeling of the majority of his UK voters, is he really prepared to spend £3.5m of tax payers money on "reviewing" evidence regarding two child neglectors, who will not shut up,who come out of this unscaved, imo it will just fuel the McCanns fire, a fire that is very critical of the UK Government, especially Ms May, someone had to step in and stop it, and that person had to be David Cameron.

Time will tell.

Hi Lilyofthevalley,

I remember David Davies, he comes from a working class background and would have made a better PM than David Cameron who will never understand
the working-class. did he suggest in his letters that the review would be comprehensive.? If it hasn"t got the backing og the PJ it is a waste of time and
money

Panda wrote:

Lillyofthevalley wrote:Angelina I have 4 letters from David Davies our conservative MP, I'm sure Cameron is fully aware of the "nutters" and the feeling of the majority of his UK voters, is he really prepared to spend £3.5m of tax payers money on "reviewing" evidence regarding two child neglectors, who will not shut up,who come out of this unscaved, imo it will just fuel the McCanns fire, a fire that is very critical of the UK Government, especially Ms May, someone had to step in and stop it, and that person had to be David Cameron.

Time will tell.

Hi Lilyofthevalley,

I remember David Davies, he comes from a working class background and would have made a better PM than David Cameron who will never understand
the working-class. did he suggest in his letters that the review would be comprehensive.? If it hasn"t got the backing og the PJ it is a waste of time and
money

Morning Panda, his last letter, was pretty much the same as the first one, he understood how I felt but couldn't comment on a ongoing case, now whether that was a ongoing case in PT or the UK I dont know, my last letter to him was back in 2009.
Yes I agree he would have made a better PM then Cameron, but imo they all change as soon as they get the top job.

Lillyofthevalley wrote:

Panda wrote:

Lillyofthevalley wrote:Angelina I have 4 letters from David Davies our conservative MP, I'm sure Cameron is fully aware of the "nutters" and the feeling of the majority of his UK voters, is he really prepared to spend £3.5m of tax payers money on "reviewing" evidence regarding two child neglectors, who will not shut up,who come out of this unscaved, imo it will just fuel the McCanns fire, a fire that is very critical of the UK Government, especially Ms May, someone had to step in and stop it, and that person had to be David Cameron.

Time will tell.

Hi Lilyofthevalley,

I remember David Davies, he comes from a working class background and would have made a better PM than David Cameron who will never understand
the working-class. did he suggest in his letters that the review would be comprehensive.? If it hasn"t got the backing og the PJ it is a waste of time and
money

Morning Panda, his last letter, was pretty much the same as the first one, he understood how I felt but couldn't comment on a ongoing case, now

whether that was a ongoing case in PT or the UK I dont know, my last letter to him was back in 2009.
Yes I agree he would have made a better PM then Cameron, but imo they all change as soon as they get the top job.

I can"t remember such a corrupt Government as we had under Tony Blair and his "New Labour" and don"t think David Cameron will clean up and
govern more fairly, since he was born he has never known anything about the working Class. I watched the Drama about he and Boris (Mayor of London) who were both at Eton at the same time. Boris the extrovert ended up as President of the Students Union . Can"t remember what he did after
but David had an Aunt who had contacts at Buckingham Palace who got him a job at Conservative Central Office.

What would the reaction of the 'ordinary' Portuguese people be, if the PJ say they are willing to back this review of the case? The people who know how much time and money and effort went into this from the off? Would there be uproar or would the people say get on with it then!

Lillyofthevalley wrote:Angelina I have 4 letters from David Davies our conservative MP, I'm sure Cameron is fully aware of the "nutters" and the feeling of the majority of his UK voters, is he really prepared to spend £3.5m of tax payers money on "reviewing" evidence regarding two child neglectors, who will not shut up,who come out of this unscaved, imo it will just fuel the McCanns fire, a fire that is very critical of the UK Government, especially Ms May, someone had to step in and stop it, and that person had to be David Cameron.

Time will tell.

Lilly, thanks for the info. DC could have shut up the McCanns by refusing point blank to do a review. Let's face it he has plenty of reasons why we can't afford for it to happen.

My take on it is that the PJ will not/cannot re-open the case without new evidence and I doubt very much if that new evidence is in the papers that Scotland Yard will be reviewing. Any real, concrete evidence is either tucked tightly away in the PJ files or has been disposed of in some way. Without the PJ files which have been withheld I can't help feeling this is a non-starter.

Let's see the review started with all of the T9 being re-interviewed by Scotland Yard...only then will I believe the review will be of any use.

ETA...I would have much preferred DD as our PM. I was very sorry when he didn't become leader of the Conservatives.

Panda wrote:Sources recall that, despite them having good criminal investigation labs, a political decision was made to have the tests carried out in English labs.

The source said:

“We let the English do everything that they want.”

I remember reading that the Portugese forensics was not considered as advanced as FSS and since the DNA evidence was so fragile it was decided to
use FSS. However , the FSS report was not conclusive and in fact they apparently destroyed the samples because the Portugese did not ask for their
return.!!!!!!

another report stated that FSS was very slow and the Portugese Police did a little experiment. they sent a sample to FSS and a few days later another
sample to their own forensic Dep. The Report on the Portugese Sample was finished and sent to the Police in two weeks, FSS took almost two
months........no wonder the Service has been sold to America.

Hi Panda

I think this proves just exactly what some of us have thought for a long time - there was someone deliberately contaminating evidence - it makes me want to retch to think that some "Member" is inside the FSS trying to obstruct an investigation into the disappearance of a little child. It's disgusting.

wjk wrote:What would the reaction of the 'ordinary' Portuguese people be, if the PJ say they are willing to back this review of the case? The people who know how much time and money and effort went into this from the off? Would there be uproar or would the people say get on with it then!

For starters there will be more work for SY than the PJ, they are the ones who have to trawl through the files in Portugal and Spain. Get translations
and more if the PJ said O.K. lets open up the Shelved files and close the case........I hope they do, because not just for the expense the PJ have incurred ,but the abuse from the British Press and contempt of the McCanns and their Family and Friends. the past interference from the Government . Let it all
come out the Taxpayer should demand nothing less

Angelique wrote:

Panda wrote:Sources recall that, despite them having good criminal investigation labs, a political decision was made to have the tests carried out in English labs.

The source said:

“We let the English do everything that they want.”

I remember reading that the Portugese forensics was not considered as advanced as FSS and since the DNA evidence was so fragile it was decided to
use FSS. However , the FSS report was not conclusive and in fact they apparently destroyed the samples because the Portugese did not ask for their
return.!!!!!!

another report stated that FSS was very slow and the Portugese Police did a little experiment. they sent a sample to FSS and a few days later another
sample to their own forensic Dep. The Report on the Portugese Sample was finished and sent to the Police in two weeks, FSS took almost two
months........no wonder the Service has been sold to America.

Hi Panda

I think this proves just exactly what some of us have thought for a long time - there was someone deliberately contaminating evidence - it makes me want to retch to think that some "Member" is inside the FSS trying to obstruct an investigation into the disappearance of a little child. It's disgusting.

Hi Angelique.......what completely baffles me is that not one item of Madeleine"s clothing, shoes , hat etc was available to be sent to forensics, I would
have charged the McCanns with obstruction straight away.

Panda wrote:

wjk wrote:What would the reaction of the 'ordinary' Portuguese people be, if the PJ say they are willing to back this review of the case? The people who know how much time and money and effort went into this from the off? Would there be uproar or would the people say get on with it then!

For starters there will be more work for SY than the PJ, they are the ones who have to trawl through the files in Portugal and Spain. Get translations
and more if the PJ said O.K. lets open up the Shelved files and close the case........I hope they do, because not just for the expense the PJ have incurred ,but the abuse from the British Press and contempt of the McCanns and their Family and Friends. the past interference from the Government . Let it all
come out the Taxpayer should demand nothing less

this is what I'm hoping for, Panda. Not because I think the PJ did not do their job properly, but for the money spent by the Portuguese, the man hours spent, with officers away from families for days on end, not to mention the abuse etc!
Theres already £3.5 million on the table for this review, lets use it to its full and go back to the very beginning. Infact, I hope the Met Leave no stone unturned!!

Panda wrote:

Angelique wrote:

Panda wrote:Sources recall that, despite them having good criminal investigation labs, a political decision was made to have the tests carried out in English labs.

The source said:

“We let the English do everything that they want.”

I remember reading that the Portugese forensics was not considered as advanced as FSS and since the DNA evidence was so fragile it was decided to
use FSS. However , the FSS report was not conclusive and in fact they apparently destroyed the samples because the Portugese did not ask for their
return.!!!!!!

another report stated that FSS was very slow and the Portugese Police did a little experiment. they sent a sample to FSS and a few days later another
sample to their own forensic Dep. The Report on the Portugese Sample was finished and sent to the Police in two weeks, FSS took almost two
months........no wonder the Service has been sold to America.

Hi Panda

I think this proves just exactly what some of us have thought for a long time - there was someone deliberately contaminating evidence - it makes me want to retch to think that some "Member" is inside the FSS trying to obstruct an investigation into the disappearance of a little child. It's disgusting.

Hi Angelique.......what completely baffles me is that not one item of Madeleine"s clothing, shoes , hat etc was available to be sent to forensics, I would
have charged the McCanns with obstruction straight away.

Panda

It's not the FSS per se - it's this wretched organisation that has seeped into every other organisation that will defend other Members and even sheild them from prosecution by all measure and means possible - even committing perjury. It is unbelievable isn't it - I despair - I really do - I think we are always going to come up against this problem - I honestly think that this is why no matter what evidence comes to light "an innocent explanation will be found" or disposed of/destroyed/altered/ - short of actually breaking down and confessing we will not see any prosecution of the McCanns no matter how many reviews or Investigations are done. Which makes me wonder - why don't they shut up and go away - why, knowing that they will always be exonerated of the crime by the backing of the Members do they not just go away. It has to be "money". Their reputation is in tatters. I could not hold my head up in the street with the knowledge that all the evidence is pointing one way but still spout the same lies over and over again.

Angelique...I know what you mean about Members. They are everywhere. I've worked with them for many years.They needed me and a handful of others to run a multi-million ££ company while the Members were at their special meetings.I was not treated the same as the Members but I did do pretty well at the end of the day.

I see the news reports such as "X narrowly avoided a custodial sentence" and think to myself , mmm, another Member gets off scot-free. The evidence was proved and admitted as the truth.

So we have this cancer in our society which would take a miracle to purge.

I would like to know WHERE in camerons letter he says he will be reviewing or reopening the case...he hasnt.


It jut says he will look into it and speak to the met.....that's it.

kitti wrote:I would like to know WHERE in camerons letter he says he will be reviewing or reopening the case...he hasnt.


It jut says he will look into it and speak to the met.....that's it.

Hi Kitti, he must have said it somewhere because the SY Police and some of his own Party were up in arms about it, and a figure of £3.5 million has been made available from Home Office Allowance.

kitti wrote:I would like to know WHERE in camerons letter he says he will be reviewing or reopening the case...he hasnt.


It jut says he will look into it and speak to the met.....that's it.

This is taken from the letter

I have asked the Home Secretary to look into what more the Government could do to help Madeleine. She will be writing to you today, setting out new action involving the Metropolitan Police Service which we hope will help boost efforts in the search for Madeleine. I sincerely hope this fresh approach will provide the investigation with the new momentum that it needs.


Have we all , including the media, taken that to mean a review?

At least it is clear the help is for Madeleine ............... no mention of the latter days Saints McCann.

Not just us, Members of his own Party criticised the £3.5 million allocated from the Home Office, the 30 SY Police Officers etc, if Cameron hasn"t given the go-ahead he would have issued a denial by now. Apparently the Portugese havn"t given their consent, but I"m sure Cameron has spoken to someone
in authority there due to Socrates not having any power, just minding the shop . I think anything that gets closure and the Mccanns out of their hair will
be welcomed by the people of Portugal. I also think the Mccanns should have offered to make a contribution from the fund.

Blueeyes wrote:

kitti wrote:I would like to know WHERE in camerons letter he says he will be reviewing or reopening the case...he hasnt.


It jut says he will look into it and speak to the met.....that's it.

This is taken from the letter

I have asked the Home Secretary to look into what more the Government could do to help Madeleine. She will be writing to you today, setting out new action involving the Metropolitan Police Service which we hope will help boost efforts in the search for Madeleine. I sincerely hope this fresh approach will provide the investigation with the new momentum that it needs.


Have we all , including the media, taken that to mean a review?

Ah! Maybe it was the Met. that mentioned they had been requested to review. Will look.