Blacksmith:They just dont get it

Not only was Amaral vindicated but the judges, as Kate McCann's Madeleine let slip, knocked away the third leg of the libel claim, damage to the so-called search. She writes: "The latest verdict was that Amaral’s poisonous allegations did not damage our investigation in any way." That's one of the three libel claims dead."


Well, the other two claims, to their health and the twins is even easier to prove ridiculous.!!!!!

Obviously the McCanns are running scared now, but what prompted this latest change? Probably because they know SY did not find any new evidence or that the PJ were remiss in their investigation. Remember, there are shelved files which were considered important, wonder what is in them.

Well we cannot know what SY has (or has not) found, but I cannot imagine they would be able to find significant fault with the efforts of the PJ.

I had forgotten about Healy's reference, in her, errm, Book and it certainly does show they were aware they were pursuing an unwinnable Case in their continuing efforts to hide from Justice. Thanks for the reminder

Panda wrote:Not only was Amaral vindicated but the judges, as Kate McCann's Madeleine let slip, knocked away the third leg of the libel claim, damage to the so-called search. She writes: "The latest verdict was that Amaral’s poisonous allegations did not damage our investigation in any way." That's one of the three libel claims dead."


Well, the other two claims, to their health and the twins is even easier to prove ridiculous.!!!!!

Obviously the McCanns are running scared now, but what prompted this latest change? Probably because they know SY did not find any new evidence or that the PJ were remiss in their investigation. Remember, there are shelved files which were considered important, wonder what is in them.

These would be the files the McCanns were trying to get opened for their eyes only.... Must be a worry for them

malena stool wrote:

Panda wrote:Not only was Amaral vindicated but the judges, as Kate McCann's Madeleine let slip, knocked away the third leg of the libel claim, damage to the so-called search. She writes: "The latest verdict was that Amaral’s poisonous allegations did not damage our investigation in any way." That's one of the three libel claims dead."


Well, the other two claims, to their health and the twins is even easier to prove ridiculous.!!!!!

Obviously the McCanns are running scared now, but what prompted this latest change? Probably because they know SY did not find any new evidence or that the PJ were remiss in their investigation. Remember, there are shelved files which were considered important, wonder what is in them.

These would be the files the McCanns were trying to get opened for their eyes only.... Must be a worry for them

Well we know they hold the phonecalls that the Judges said would be an intrusion when asked by the PJ if they could be used in a Trial. The Prosecutor asked a Judge if he thought there was enough evidence to go to Trial and the Judge said "show me the body"......which of course still applies. The original statements will be in the Files and some witness staements we don't know about I bet they make interesting reading.

jd16 wrote:To anyone following Operation Fernbridge I think it is clear what sallypelt means. Ive had the same reaction over the past few weeks of what is being discovered about the UK's establishment, which looks very much like it is also spread & networked across Europe. All the dots are joining up and quite how the public are going to stomach it if it becomes mainstream I don't know is how I feel about it all too

Hmmmm, l see what you mean....someone else wrote something similar..... Rather than getting ALL those involved in such activities are we going to get two (or three) notorious ones exposed?

It would be quite amusing that far from bring protected by their mates -favours being called in and all that- they may just be the sacrificial lambs.

But if they were sacrificed, that must surely backfire on those who do the sacrificing? Isn't that part of the deal - Healy & McCann having enough dirt to have escaped Justice hitherto.

If sacrificed, then that would be the cue to actually dish that dirt.


(I think I've been having a bit of a Bernard Woolley day today: I'll be better tomorrow!)

The End Is Nigh wrote:But if they were sacrificed, that must surely backfire on those who do the sacrificing? Isn't that part of the deal - Healy & McCann having enough dirt to have escaped Justice hitherto.

If sacrificed, then that would be the cue to actually dish that dirt.


(I think I've been having a bit of a Bernard Woolley day today: I'll be better tomorrow!)

Have a lie down in the dark for 15 minutes then make a cup of tea.....NO ALCOHOL !! and that should clear your head.

One thing I remember that springs to mind which maybe caused the "shock" is that David Payne was called on to do a Tracheotomy on Madeleine which failed. This was reported on 3a's in the early days and could account for Gerry asking Payne to go to their Apartment , making the excuse it was to see if Kate wanted to bring the children down to the Tennis Court. Payne says he was in the Apartment 30 minutes, Kate says 3 minutes. It would account for the bllodspots on the wall, behind the Settee, and Kate having a Spring Clean.

...and it would account for that disastrous radio interview, where (can't remember which of the Tapas females) made reference to the fact that they 'would know how to resuscitate someone'...

Ah yes, that would be Rachael Oldfield - and the interviewer hadn't even mentioned resuscitation!
Now how on earth did that particular procedure enter her head at that moment?

Oops, what a giveaway!

Panda wrote:

The End Is Nigh wrote:But if they were sacrificed, that must surely backfire on those who do the sacrificing? Isn't that part of the deal - Healy & McCann having enough dirt to have escaped Justice hitherto.

If sacrificed, then that would be the cue to actually dish that dirt.


(I think I've been having a bit of a Bernard Woolley day today: I'll be better tomorrow!)

Have a lie down in the dark for 15 minutes then make a cup of tea.....NO ALCOHOL !! and that should clear your head.

One thing I remember that springs to mind which maybe caused the "shock" is that David Payne was called on to do a Tracheotomy on Madeleine which failed. This was reported on 3a's in the early days and could account for Gerry asking Payne to go to their Apartment , making the excuse it was to see if Kate wanted to bring the children down to the Tennis Court. Payne says he was in the Apartment 30 minutes, Kate says 3 minutes. It would account for the bllodspots on the wall, behind the Settee, and Kate having a Spring Clean.

what would the purpose of a tracheotomy be an in what situation would Maddie have needed it?
Only if she really smashed her head in falling off the back of the sofa?

I do believe that they tried resuscitating her, hence the blood splatter.

Loopdaloop wrote:

Panda wrote:

The End Is Nigh wrote:But if they were sacrificed, that must surely backfire on those who do the sacrificing? Isn't that part of the deal - Healy & McCann having enough dirt to have escaped Justice hitherto.

If sacrificed, then that would be the cue to actually dish that dirt.


(I think I've been having a bit of a Bernard Woolley day today: I'll be better tomorrow!)

Have a lie down in the dark for 15 minutes then make a cup of tea.....NO ALCOHOL !! and that should clear your head.

One thing I remember that springs to mind which maybe caused the "shock" is that David Payne was called on to do a Tracheotomy on Madeleine which failed. This was reported on 3a's in the early days and could account for Gerry asking Payne to go to their Apartment , making the excuse it was to see if Kate wanted to bring the children down to the Tennis Court. Payne says he was in the Apartment 30 minutes, Kate says 3 minutes. It would account for the bllodspots on the wall, behind the Settee, and Kate having a Spring Clean.

what would the purpose of a tracheotomy be an in what situation would Maddie have needed it?
Only if she really smashed her head in falling off the back of the sofa?

I do believe that they tried resuscitating her, hence the blood splatter.

A tracheotomy is performed by putting a tube into the windpipe of someone to ease their breathing , If Madeleine did fall from the back of the Settee she could have gone into shock , not necessarily smashed her head. Remember also Gerry said she had a nosebleed.

Panda wrote:

Loopdaloop wrote:

Panda wrote:

The End Is Nigh wrote:But if they were sacrificed, that must surely backfire on those who do the sacrificing? Isn't that part of the deal - Healy & McCann having enough dirt to have escaped Justice hitherto.

If sacrificed, then that would be the cue to actually dish that dirt.


(I think I've been having a bit of a Bernard Woolley day today: I'll be better tomorrow!)

Have a lie down in the dark for 15 minutes then make a cup of tea.....NO ALCOHOL !! and that should clear your head.

One thing I remember that springs to mind which maybe caused the "shock" is that David Payne was called on to do a Tracheotomy on Madeleine which failed. This was reported on 3a's in the early days and could account for Gerry asking Payne to go to their Apartment , making the excuse it was to see if Kate wanted to bring the children down to the Tennis Court. Payne says he was in the Apartment 30 minutes, Kate says 3 minutes. It would account for the bllodspots on the wall, behind the Settee, and Kate having a Spring Clean.

what would the purpose of a tracheotomy be an in what situation would Maddie have needed it?
Only if she really smashed her head in falling off the back of the sofa?

I do believe that they tried resuscitating her, hence the blood splatter.

A tracheotomy is performed by putting a tube into the windpipe of someone to ease their breathing , If Madeleine did fall from the back of the Settee she could have gone into shock , not necessarily smashed her head. Remember also Gerry said she had a nosebleed.

But then, why a need to cover it up? Why not do
the proper thing and seek medical help and services?

They (doctors) of all people would know how to resuscitate Madeleine and they tried but were unsuccessful. The blood splatter is evidence of that. Nose bleed?? - part of the coverup to explain the blood. Calling for additional help from medical services would only call attention to the neglect issue - leaving three children under the age of four unattended resulting in the death of Madeleine. Much easier to raise the 'abduction alarm' and hope people would understand their explanation of why they left the children alone - "it was our holiday too".

ROB was the only casualty doctor in the group, he would be the obvious one to carry out the tracheotomy, remember he went missing for an hour on the evening 3rd May as his child allegedly was ill. but then still went back to the tapas to finish his meal

nospinnaker wrote:...and it would account for that disastrous radio interview, where (can't remember which of the Tapas females) made reference to the fact that they 'would know how to resuscitate someone'...

Rachel Oldfield I remember listening to that radio interview...

Her arrogance was unbelievable

I've got that strange feeling again - the one where it seems as if I'm living in a parallel universe, or perhaps I'm in the real universe and the British media and establishment are in the parallel one? Whichever it is, here we go again - significant developments take place in Portugal and are discussed openly in the Portuguese media, whilst back in Blighty they might just as well not be happening at all. I've scanned the newspapers right up to the end of the day and found - nothing. Perhaps following the over-the-top reporting in the summer of 2007 some kind of legal gag was put on the British media which stops them from reporting news about the McCanns which has been taken solely from their Portuguese counterparts; a super injunction which is so super that the media are not even at liberty to mention it? This would mean that unless the spokesman, close friend of the family or family member, provided some kind of statement, nothing would appear in the media in the UK wouldn't it? Furthermore, since nobody of that ilk has actually said anything, perhaps we're witnessing the tactics so succinctly summed up by the penultimate sentence in the recent piece by Blacksmith, "Highlight the one. Keep the lid on the other." This does indeed seem to be happening at the present time. So, if they're keeping the lid on the Portuguese news, the question arises as to just what they intend to highlight? Perhaps there's a real possibility of the case in the UK going the McCanns' way so that they are able to make a huge PR splash throughout the media to reinforce their message of, "Don't try this at home!" After all, the juduciary in the UK seem to be more interested in points of procedure and protecting their own status as opposed to seeking truth and justice and they do not give a flying fig for what goes on in foreign jurisdictions anyway. Meanwhile over in Portugal they've won an extra 6 months for SY to come up with a solution which would disprove Dr Amaral's theory and that of the original investigation which might enable them to rescue something from the shambles. I suppose we'll just have to wait and see what develops in Portugal and how things develop in the UK before we can see a clear picture emerging. One thing that I have learned over the past 5 years however, is that nothing is as it seems and no twist to this story is too outlandish. That last sentence of Blacksmith's might therefore very quickly come back to haunt him, "The lid's off. They are toast."

Just to clear up the nose bleed...

The defence lawyer said that he wishes the arguido to be asked again if Madeleine bled.

To which he said it was common for Madeleine to have nosebleeds.

He says that he doesn’t know if in fact his daughter bled while on holiday in Portugal, because he does not want to be influenced by the news in the Press, regarding the detection of human blood in the apartment where his daughter disappeared.

Hi T4two...As much as we might like to see the media go to town on the McCanns & Co for what we know...is there a case for having to be careful what goes to print,we wouldn't want justice being thwarted on any technicality...i know im such a gullible naive optimist but have to bring balance
I cant see SY coming up with a patsy but if they do...we're all toast

matthew wrote:
...As much as we might like to see the media go to town on the McCanns & Co for what we know...is there a case for having to be careful what goes to print,we wouldn't want justice being thwarted on any technicality...i know im such a gullible naive optimist but have to bring balance

Agree entirely.

But the point is that every single time it seems as if the whole truth will come out it doesn't. I don't see the reason for this delay. The only thing I can think of is that by the time the next trial comes Scotland Yard will have ruled on abduction. If they have the power to do this. I can't think of any other reason why they would want a delay. I don't get it either. In fact I never have. Trying to apply logic to this seems impossible. Nothing but confusion.

MaryB wrote:But the point is that every single time it seems as if the whole truth will come out it doesn't. I don't see the reason for this delay. The only thing I can think of is that by the time the next trial comes Scotland Yard will have ruled on abduction. If they have the power to do this. I can't think of any other reason why they would want a delay. I don't get it either. In fact I never have. Trying to apply logic to this seems impossible. Nothing but confusion.

Exactly

SY & DC said they would keep the McCanns in touch with how the review was going,does anyone think SY has a patsy in mind? ...why do the McCanns want to settle with Amaral then...a delaying tactic?...could still go ahead...lose...then come back with a bigger libel claim + interest
Amaral once said,things are not going well for the McCanns...this quote was before we had the panorama programme with Redwood's,alive or sadly dead quote
After panorama we then had Amaral saying SY are looking at abduction only...was he told to play it down?...i think so

If SY have a patsy in mind, then they'd better look out - it would be pure folly.
They will know that there are many many people out there, and especially in the global new media, who are patiently watching and waiting, and are already primed to scream 'whitewash!' at the merest sniff of a conspiracy. Not only that, but the wider world is already aware of, and disgusted at, the Met's sullied reputation of late. Add a McCann dimension to that and all hell would break loose.

As for the McCanns being kept in the loop, I bet they have a family liaison officer (par for the course) but nothing more. Leaking operational details to them would be barmy, and it would make their work a whole lot more difficult if not impossible. On the other hand, leaking limited information, or even disinformation, could be useful. Especially if the pair try to prise out more info and start asking all sorts of questions - it's easy to fool people into a slip by this method - yes, even the manipulative ones.

As for Mr Amaral's two comments - he may have decided to temper the first remark with the second, or maybe he was playing Gezza's little obfuscation game - confusion is good!

Yep, that sums it all up nicely, almostgothic


There simply is no way at all that SY can "produce" Evidence to support the Adbuction tale and certainly no way that they could get the Portuguese to swallow any hypotheses that aren't robustly demonstrable.

Past performance is really not the best indicator for future performance although I can understand that some people will only ever look at the down-side.

I do expect the Portuguese to be in a position to re-open the Case in due course, but it's a bit early yet - And their are always going to be Diplomatic,Political and Financial considerations which need to be dealt with as well.

Roll on Summer ......................

I'm quite sure the SY review has found nothing to tempt the PJ to re-open the case or it would have been done by now.

The only conclusions SY can come to is that the PJ Final report stands , that Madeliene was abducted or that she died in 5a......can't remember the other two theories.

The McCanns don't want to sue Amaral because their claims are groundless and they are nervous about what Amaral will say in a Courtroom to support his theory that Madeleine died in 5a. He may have information which has not been published.

The McCanns have enjoyed unprecedented Government and Public support but not far off two years and almost £3 million of public money later, they will lose a lot of public sympathy and definitely interest in Kate's new Book because the PJ has been vindicated.

duncanmac wrote:ROB was the only casualty doctor in the group, he would be the obvious one to carry out the tracheotomy, remember he went missing for an hour on the evening 3rd May as his child allegedly was ill. but then still went back to the tapas to finish his meal

Yes duncanmac I remember , and wasn't there talk of him washing a sheet and putting it over the balcony because he said his child was sick. He also was the only one who never turned up at the U.K. Court when the Tapas 7 learned they would receive £37,500 each and the McCanns £600,000.

I will never understand why the PJ did not order a recon within days of the Witness statements received, Mouro the American Detective employed by CBS to investigate because he spoke Portugese said Tanner wasn't even in the Tapas restaurant that night according to the Waiters.!!!!