has the fat lady sung yet?

cant always take notice of the newspapers ,so shouldn't worry just yet.joyce1938

I SEE THERE ARE 7 LEGAL CHALLENGES TO BREXIT ON CONSTITUATIONAL GROUNDS.

Fuzeta, I agrre with you,we don't need to dance to their tune , I believe they are in worse place than we are financially.by the way did you get my last message ?joyce1938

joyce1938 wrote:Fuzeta, I agrre with you,we don't need to dance to their tune , I believe they are in worse place than we are financially.by the way did you get my last message ?joyce1938

Hello Joyce, I got your original message about R. I have sent you two messages since and I am waiting hear how he is. I hope that you got my messages. First one was sent a few days ago, another one yesterday. I do hope things are going well. xxx

fuzeta wrote:Good afternoon both.  Apparently the petition with these signatures is being investigated for fraud.  The petition allows people to only give a name and email address, then any address they can think of, so you can guess the rest.  Many people are signing it who are not even allowed to vote, one way or another.   Many are kids, non British citizens, people from other countries and the nuts that will jump on to anything. Also many signing it several times.  I hope it is treated with the contempt it deserves.

Good morning fuzeta

According to the news yesterday, the referendum was advisory only. It still has to be debated, and voted on by our political masters you know, the ones who sit on the floor in train carriages, and then claim there were no seats available. The same people who manipulate expenses, lash out knighthoods etc. So what was the point of this referendum?

In the run up to the referendum, much was said about how the money we woud save would adequately fund the NHS. Now we are told that of a certainty a number of A & E departments will close, and shortage of money might even cause the closures of some entire hospitals, Where is this money we were going to have?

I don't know if you ever watch Judge Judy on the box.She has a thing about teenagers. You know they are lying because their lips are moving she claims. For American (and British) teenagers, substitute British and American politicians

I HAVE READ HEADLINES ON MSN NEWS,I THINK THAT SUGGEST THERESA MAY WILL GO AHEAD WITH BREXIT WITHOUT PARLIAMENTARY VOTE.
THERE WILL BE A CABINET MEETING TO DECEIDE ON WAY AHEAD.

THEY RECKON CIVIL SERVANTS ARE OBSTRUCTING THE MOVE TOWARDS BREXIT.

katertaif wrote:

fuzeta wrote:Good afternoon both.  Apparently the petition with these signatures is being investigated for fraud.  The petition allows people to only give a name and email address, then any address they can think of, so you can guess the rest.  Many people are signing it who are not even allowed to vote, one way or another.   Many are kids, non British citizens, people from other countries and the nuts that will jump on to anything. Also many signing it several times.  I hope it is treated with the contempt it deserves.

Good morning fuzeta

According to the news yesterday, the referendum was advisory only. It still has to be debated, and voted on by our political masters you know, the ones who sit on the floor in train carriages, and then claim there were no seats available. The same people who manipulate expenses, lash out knighthoods etc. So what was the point of this referendum?

In the run up to the referendum, much was said about how the money we woud save would adequately fund the NHS. Now we are told that of a certainty a number of A & E departments will close, and shortage of money  might even cause the closures of some entire hospitals, Where is this money we were going to have?

I don't know if you ever watch Judge Judy on the box.She has a thing about teenagers. You know they are lying because their lips are moving she claims. For American (and British) teenagers, substitute British and American politicians

Hello Katertaif
I agree with what you say about our politicians, the same as the world over I would imagine. Maybe not quite when you see what some of them are doing in the poorer countries.

It seems that ( as badboy said)Theresa May has stated that there will be no parliamentary vote on Brexit. Very unpopular decision with the politicians with their noses in the trough or hoping to get it in.

The obvious answer to the NHS, if they want to save it, is cut our foreign aid by half. 12 billion or more given away every year. Most of the time ending up in despots hands who use it to build another palace. Whilst here people are dying because of lack of emergency services. Hospitals closing. Even to get a doctors appointment I just waited five weeks. Old people having to wait 2 years for cataract operations. Many old people's only pleasure is reading and watching TV, it's a disgrace I see that people come from abroad especially to have this operation done (not from part of the EU) and then go home without paying the bill. As they are supposed to be paying they jump to the front of the queue!

Our country is well overpopulated and essential services cannot cope. Why do the politicians not do something now? It's always a promise for several years hence. By that time we will be in a terrible mess. I despair

Badboy wrote:APPEARS BREXIT WILL NOT HAPPEN UNTIL 2019.
SEEMS A LONG WHILE.

It does seem a long time badboy. I am seriously starting to wonder if it will happen at all. We've had a referendum, the vote was in favour of leaving the EU. Not by a landslide true, but by a majority. In a democracy, that majority should prevail. Those demanding a second referendum, to get the right result this time, obviously don't believe in democracy. If they did get another referendum, and the vote did go their way, what then? Another referendum, best of three?

Then again, Theresa May is saying no, we will implement the wishes of the British people. When exactly will that happen? An Italian politician, who says he drew up article 50 says it is meaningless. We can trigger it, and begin the process of withdrawing from the EU far faster than our politicians are making out. Remember many MP's were/are in favour of staying in. The longer it goes on, the better they will be suited.

Apart from anything else Obama ought to keep his nose out of it. This is the man who openly said that we could no longer rely on the USA any more. The man who says we would be at the back of the queue (10 years) in any trade deal with the USA when he has less than 6 months in office anyway. If the mess he made of his much vauntd deal with Iran is anything to go by, we have little need to worry.

That just about sums it up katertaif. Will Brexit ever mean Brexit? I very much doubt it. Theresa May is worrying me, she is now saying that she does not want to show our hand to the powers that be in the EU. Well she did that as soon as she was elected PM. Straight away she said "that we want to stay in the Single Market, that it was very important"

Other countries would also lose a lot of trade if we did leave the Single Market, especially Germany. so why has she not played a decent game? Now they know what she wants and will make us suffer to get it. She has lost our chance of any bargaining power. Not a good start

LIAM FOX HAS SAID BRITISH BUSINESSMEN ARE FAT AND LAZY,SO TRADE DEALS MIGHT BE A PROBLEM,NOT SURE IF RELEVANT TO THREAD.
I GET IMPRESSION THAT THE POLITICANS HAVE NO IDEA ON BREXIT,HOW TO DO IT.
BRITONS TRAVELLING TO EUROPE MAY HAVE TO PAY A VISA FEE.

OWEN SMITH SAYS HE WOULD TAKE UK BACK INTO EU IF ELECTED LABOUR LEADER AND PM;SOURCE DAILY MAIL WHICH I DON'T NORMALLY READ BUT GUARDIAN UNAVAIBLE.

So much for our Democratic procedures if Smith gets elected as leader of the Labour Party and then wins at the next General Election..

BREXIT PROCESS WILL START AT END OF MARCH 2017 SO MAY HAS SAID.

TONY BLAIR HAS SAID THERE SHOULD BE A CAMPAIGN AGAINST BREXIT CALLING FOR AN ORGANISED EFFORT.

I doubt if many would want Tony Blair opinion ,he should stay out of it .jouce1938

Badboy wrote:TONY BLAIR HAS SAID THERE SHOULD BE A CAMPAIGN AGAINST BREXIT CALLING FOR AN ORGANISED EFFORT.

He wants to be master of Europe Badboy and if the scabrous pig needs to be European Supremo that bad he needs to revoke his UK nationality and search for a European nation that would have him. But would any nation stoop so low as to want a bare faced liar for a leader, especially one with so much blood on his hands?

malena stool wrote:

Badboy wrote:TONY BLAIR HAS SAID THERE SHOULD BE A CAMPAIGN AGAINST BREXIT CALLING FOR AN ORGANISED EFFORT.

He wants to bee master of Europe Badboy and if the scabrous pig needs to be European Supremo that bad he needs to revoke his UK nationality and search for a European nation that would have him. But would any nation stoop so low as to want a bare faced liar for a leader, especially one with so much blood on his hands?

There is no need to beat about the bush my friend. Just come out with it and say what you mean. Having said that I agree with you all the way. I don't think he even tried to hide that his immediate ambition was to be Europe's first president. That fell through of course. Now he is trying for a second referendum a la Eire. It will mean a lot of egg on his scabrous face if he gets the same answer. Same with Clegg. They have proved themselves completely undemocratic, but then I think that was glaringly obvious from the start. As you say, what country would take him? There are still a vast majority of MP's who are to say the least unwilling to accept the result of the referendum. I personally believe they will scupper Brexit if they possibly can; if for no other reason than to prove the supremacy of Parliament over us - the great unwashed - Hoping that the old saw of a week being a long time in politics giving enough time for us to forget what a venal self serving crew they are. I see a piece this morning where Amber Rudd and a dozen or so others by reappointing Vaz are being accuse of bringing parliament into disrepute. Never:who would have thought it. The expenses scandal (still rife) simply exposed what they had been doing for years. Nothing has changed, they have simply found ways of hiding Their mercenary greed

katertaif wrote:

malena stool wrote:

Badboy wrote:TONY BLAIR HAS SAID THERE SHOULD BE A CAMPAIGN AGAINST BREXIT CALLING FOR AN ORGANISED EFFORT.

He wants to bee master of Europe Badboy and if the scabrous pig needs to be European Supremo that bad he needs to revoke his UK nationality and search for a European nation that would have him. But would any nation stoop so low as to want a bare faced liar for a leader, especially one with so much blood on his hands?

There is no need to beat about the bush my friend. Just come out with it and say what you mean. Having said that I agree with you all the way. I don't think he even tried to hide that his immediate ambition was to be Europe's first president. That fell through of course. Now he is trying for a second referendum a la Eire. It will mean a lot of egg on his scabrous face if he gets the same answer. Same with Clegg. They have proved themselves completely undemocratic, but then I think that was glaringly obvious from the start. As you say, what country would take him? There are still a vast majority of MP's who are to say the least unwilling to accept the result of the referendum. I personally believe they will scupper Brexit if they possibly can; if for no other reason than to prove the supremacy  of Parliament over us - the great unwashed -  Hoping that the old saw of a week being a long time in politics giving enough time for us to forget what a venal self serving crew they are. I see a piece this morning where Amber Rudd and a dozen or so others by reappointing  Vaz are being accuse of bringing parliament into disrepute. Never:who would have thought it. The expenses scandal (still rife) simply exposed what they had been doing for years. Nothing has changed, they have simply found ways of hiding Their mercenary greed

Good evening katertaif, Blair’s desire to become EU president was and seemingly still is an obsession with him, a fact well reported following his stepping down from ‘leadership’ of New Labour and handing the PM post to his backstabbing buddy, wall eyed Brown. I’ve done a quick Wikipedia search and discovered he’d asked Bill Clinton to write an endorsement of his 'personal qualities' that made him the best candidate for the post (found in one of Hilary’s emails). http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3220046/Blair-asked-Bill-Clinton-write-newspaper-article-backing-bid-European-Council-president-Hillary-s-released-emails-reveal.html

I believe that Democracy here in the UK exists only when our leaders feel the need to allow us a vote and the Brexit vote taking the day shocked them to the core. If there is a way to stop the UK leaving they will find and act on it. Despite all that May shouts the odds that we will leave, the terms we leave under may possibly leave doors open for free access to borders for EU residents.

The Vaz episode is unbelievable, any ‘normal’ working man/woman displaying his tendencies to corrupt and devious practices that Vaz has shown since coming to this country and attaining ministerial power would result in gaol time. We all know that there will be long drawn out ‘investigations’, a plethora of ‘D notices’ and eventually the CPS (Can’t Prosecute Service) will fail to find sufficient there is evidence available, as with the expenses thefts from the public purse by our ‘Honourable Members’.

THE HIGH COURT HAS RULED PARLIAMENT MUST VOTE ON BREXIT,ACCORDING TO GUARDIAN NEWS ON A TWITTER LINK.

Badboy wrote:THE HIGH COURT HAS RULED PARLIAMENT MUST VOTE ON BREXIT,ACCORDING TO GUARDIAN NEWS ON A TWITTER LINK.

Yes Ms Miller the investment manager obviously has her own interests at heart. The elite against, as Malena always says, "the great unwashed'  who Ms Miller seems to think do not have the intelligence to have a vote on this issue

SAW A HEADLINE THAT I THOUGHT SAID PM HAD RESIGNED,ONLY TO REALIZE IT WAS A MP RESIGNING.
DO THEY ACTUALLY KNOW WHAT THEY ARE DOING ON BREXIT,I GET IMPRESSION THAT NOBODY KNOWS WHAT ARE DOING.

Hi Badboy, the latest (at this time) on Google
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-legal-challenge-latest-loses-verdict-theresa-may-article-50-parliament-approval-uk-eu-high-a7394856.html

Theresa May’s plans for triggering Brexit were plunged into chaos today by a sensational High Court judgment that she cannot bypass Parliament.

In a decision that forced Ms May to insist she would not call an early election, three judges ruled the Prime Minister does not have the right to use the Royal Prerogative to invoke the Article 50 notice to leave the EU without involving MPs and peers.

The extraordinary development throws into confusion whether Ms May can stick to her timetable to trigger Article 50 by the end of March – and leave the EU by spring 2019.

Nigel Farage hints at revolution if parliament blocks Brexit
On a turbulent day for Theresa May that was branded by many, including leaders in Europe as "humiliating", Downing Street had to dismiss talk of an early general election.

In other developments over the course of a remarkable day:

Theresa May told European leaders that the setback will not derail her plan to begin Brexit talks by the end of March 2017

The Government admitted that an Act of Parliament is likely to be needed to trigger Article 50
It was confirmed the Government would take the ruling to the Supreme Court
Bookies slashed the odds on Brexit not happening
The decision led to a sharp spike in both the pound and the FTSE 250
European leaders responded by calling it a 'humiliation' for the PM
A poll showed the majority of voters would now vote for Remain
Nigel Farage warned of revolution if Parliament tried to block Brexit
If the judgment leads to the Government being forced to push a Bill through Parliament – with numerous chances for it to be amended - there is thought to be virtually no chance of that timetable being achieved.

The Government immediately confirmed it would challenge the ruling at the Supreme Court – probably on December 7 – with speculation the case could end up at the European Court of Justice.

Later, Downing Street moved to dismiss talk of an early general election. With just a narrow majority in the House of Commons and most MPs having backed Remain the ruling by the court presents a new hurdle to the PM – who would be far from certain to get Article 50 through.

However, asked about the possibility of an early election to shore up the Conservatives’ majority, the Prime Minister's official spokesperson said: “No. Our position has been clear that there shouldn’t be an election until 2020 – and that remains the Prime Minister’s view.”

Current polls suggest Ms May would be returned to office with a significantly increased majority as Labour flounders on some of its lowest poll ratings in recent history.

On a remarkable morning, the pound immediately surged on the news, as the markets judged it would make it more difficult – at the very least – for Ms May to pursue a so-called ‘hard Brexit.

And Ladbrokes slashed the odds on a snap general election next year to 2-1, amid a belief that the Prime Minister will turn to the voters if she runs into an impasse at Parliament.


Given the huge Conservative lead in the polls, that could hand Ms May a much bigger Commons majority than the slender 12 which she inherited from David Cameron - and greater freedom to deliver Brexit.

In a devastating judgment for the Government, the Lord Chief Justice said its arguments had been contrary to “fundamental constitutional principles of the sovereignty of Parliament”.

What experts have said about Brexit

The ruling said: “The court does not accept the argument put forward by the government. There is nothing in the text of the 1972 Act [to join the EU] to support it."

Tim Farron, the Liberal Democrat leader, hailed the decision as “the chance to say no to an irresponsible hard Brexit that risks our economy and our jobs”.

He said: “It is critical that the government now lay out their negotiating to Parliament, before such a vote is held. So far, May’s team have been all over the place.”

But a furious Nigel Farage said: “I worry that a betrayal may be near at hand. Our political class, who were out in force, do not accept the 23rd of June Referendum result.

Jingoistic Tory MP wants BBC to play national anthem to honour Brexit
“I now fear that every attempt will be made to block or delay the triggering of Article 50. If this is so, they have no idea of the level of public anger they will provoke.”

And prominent Conservative Leaver Dominic Raab said: “This case is a plain attempt to block Brexit by people who are out of touch with the country and refuse to respect the result.”

Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn said the party “respects the decision of the British people to leave the European Union”.

But he added: “This ruling underlines the need for the Government to bring its negotiating terms to parliament without delay.”

A delighted Nicky Morgan, a Conservative MP who has demanded that MPs vote on Article 50, said: “Democracy has been asserted.”

But she added: “We are very well aware of how people voted – 17 million to leave the European Union in June – and I expect that Parliament will trigger the approval of the Article 50 notice.”

It is thought unlikely that MPs will seek to block Brexit, because – although a majority were pro-Remain – most, especially nervous Labour MPs, now accept the verdict of voters in June.

However, MPs - and peers in the House of Lords – could be handed the opportunity to challenge, or even delay, the process, if they are not satisfied with the Government’s strategy.

The ruling is a huge blow to Ms May, who tore into MPs wanting to influence Brexit at the Conservative conference, claiming they “are not standing up for democracy, they’re trying to subvert it”.

Gina Miller delivers her statement outside the High Court
She said: “They’re not trying to get Brexit right, they’re trying to kill it by delaying it. They are insulting the intelligence of the British people.”

The challenge was brought by Gina Miller, a London businesswoman, arguing the inevitable consequence of invoking Article 50 was the loss of statutory rights enjoyed by UK and EU citizens.

They included the right to refer a legal case to the European Court of Justice, of freedom of movement and to sell services – rights which should only be taken away by Parliament.

The Attorney General argued, unsuccessfully, that the court challenge was an attempt to “invalidate” the public’s decision, in the June referendum, to leave the EU.

In a brief statement, a Government spokesman said: “The Government is disappointed by the Court’s judgment.

“The country voted to leave the European Union in a referendum approved by Act of Parliament. And the Government is determined to respect the result of the referendum. We will appeal this judgment.”

Ms Miller herself said: “This result today is about all of us - our United Kingdom and our futures.

“It is not about how any of us voted – each of us voted to do what we believed was the right thing for our country. This case is about process, not politics.

“However you voted on June 23, we all owe it to our country to uphold the highest standards of transparency and democratic accountability that we are admired and respected for around the world.”

IRONICALLY GOVERNMENT MIGHT APPEAL TO EUROPEAN COURT OF HUMAN RIGHTS TO WIN CASE,HOW IRONIC!