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Bring Me The Body

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Bring Me The Body

Post  Guest on Fri 27 Apr - 10:04

I'm sure it must have been discussed in the dim and distant past, but I had a search here and couldn't find any References:

Why is it generally assumed that Madeleine's cadaver was ultimately buried or otherwise hidden?

The point is, a body - even that of a small child - is going to be cumbersome to carry and transport and relatively difficult to lay to rest undetected.

Ashes, however, occupy little volume, are very light in weight and could be carried with consummate ease, even by a passenger on an aircraft for example.



If the debate has already been exhausted, would some kind soul direct me to it?

Or we could just start a new debate, brought up to date.


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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  kitti on Fri 27 Apr - 10:29

The body is probably still in pdl......KM felt closer to her there and the only reason they left was because they had no choice....but where.

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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  Guest on Fri 27 Apr - 10:36

Could Kate not be close to Madeleine at home in Rothley ..................... ??

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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  kitti on Fri 27 Apr - 10:42

I would think she would be closest to her at home especially in her bedroom , but no, she felt closer to her in pdl as ....THAT WAS THE LAST TIME SHE SAW HER... THAT WAS THE LAST TIME SHE HELD HER

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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  Guest on Fri 27 Apr - 10:55

An urn on the mantelpiece would be a constant reminder and source of comfort, would it not?

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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  Guest on Fri 27 Apr - 15:27

Bump.

Anyone else?

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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  ProfessorPlum on Fri 27 Apr - 17:34

But where would the cremation have taken place?

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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  matthew on Fri 27 Apr - 17:57

I remember a pet crematorium being searched in the Algarve,obv no evidence to suggest anything found but its certainly possible but would surely need another involvement,Pat Brown suggested with the climate in Portugal that mummification could be performed,there was a truck with a Madeleine banner that drove from GB to portugal,maybe other vehicles...private jets,think there is opportunity for repatriation.

Cant access hideho site(forum aimoo) at the moment but there was an interesting date in July21-28? that a lot of family members were there & were said to have visited sagres...which to get there you could pass through Budens,Burgau,Vilo Do Bisbo,where Gerrys phone had pinged the antenna after his American trip...

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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  ProfessorPlum on Fri 27 Apr - 18:15

I really dont believe in the possibility of a crfemation.

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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  Panda on Fri 27 Apr - 18:22


The Crematorium was sealed and when Police checked the Seal had not been broken.

There is one theory that the Portugese have is that Madeleine' s body was thrown from nearby cliffs, quite feasible. If the McCanns still had the Buggy
Madeleines body could have been hidden in the Tennis bag and while everyone else was searching Gerry could have slipped away un-noticed and
wheeled the buggy to the Cliffs, or carried it to the Cliffs.

If on the other hand Madeleine WAS abducted by someone who kept watch on 5a, saw Gerry leave at about 9.10PM , went into 5a via the Patio Doors
chloroformed Madeleine walked out with her the way he came and took her to a Car parked nearby. Since Oldfield only listened at the Window and Kate
went into 5a at 10pm the Abductor would have had a good start before the Police Arrived.



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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  mossman on Fri 27 Apr - 18:49

Panda wrote:
The Crematorium was sealed and when Police checked the Seal had not been broken.

There is one theory that the Portugese have is that Madeleine' s body was thrown from nearby cliffs, quite feasible. If the McCanns still had the Buggy
Madeleines body could have been hidden in the Tennis bag and while everyone else was searching Gerry could have slipped away un-noticed and
wheeled the buggy to the Cliffs, or carried it to the Cliffs.

If on the other hand Madeleine WAS abducted by someone who kept watch on 5a, saw Gerry leave at about 9.10PM , went into 5a via the Patio Doors
chloroformed Madeleine walked out with her the way he came and took her to a Car parked nearby. Since Oldfield only listened at the Window and Kate
went into 5a at 10pm the Abductor would have had a good start before the Police Arrived.


When I wondered if Madeleine was in actual fact taken that night, I felt that the only way in which this would have been done is if the McCanns were not telling the truth on the frequency of their checks. If she had been left alone for an hour or more it would throw a whole different light on the matter in terms of opportunity for the abductor. The Tapas group could very well have walked out those doors at 8.30 - 9.00 and not returned until 10.00, BUT:-


This will never explain the dogs findings . If you really wanted to push the boat out and say somebody brought a dead body with them in a bag on holiday before the McCanns used the apartment, ok, that will explain the cadaver alert. Then Madeleine had a nose bleed so that explains blood alert. However, then we have to explain the car, the key, the clothes, cuddlecat. How can we do that ? Were both dogs having a crazy day, whereas up to then they were reliable, suddenly both of them got it so wrong on all counts. I just cannot accept that.

Obviously there is much than this to question, that list is endless, no point in re-hasing it here. I have tried and tried to see a way in which she may have been taken, in the interests of fairness. I have got to say I cannot raise one doubt that would lead to supporting the abduction theory.

Where is she ? How I would love to know poor pet. But there are two things I cannot wipe from my mind, that sit there all of the time and niggle at me:

1. The phrase "they have taken her" if this is what Kate said. This means more than she has gone.

2. David Payne, the shadow in the background all week. Matt, Russell, Jane, they all came under the line of fire for various different reasons. Payne not so. It was he who went off straight after the alarm was raised and searched at the beach and between the rocks all on his own. This was before the police arrived and the few out searching would have assumed they were looking for a girl alone. They would not necessarily have been looking for someone doing something out of the ordinary. Too focused on a lost little girl.

Unexpected issues brought him to the forefront in this, Yvonne Martin and the Gaspers. But as a character in the play that was in PDL, he had a silent role, hidden in the background. He was too "clean" particularly that Thursday night, he does not even seem to have left the table to use the toilet. It is nearly over emphasised that he did not move from the table, without it ever being said out loud, iykwim.


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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  Not Born Yesterday on Fri 27 Apr - 18:56

I understand that the Catholic Church prefers that bodies are not cremated but then of course it's not happy about IVF treatment either.......

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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  Guest on Fri 27 Apr - 18:57

True, but the interest in observing Catholicism seems to have come on rather suddenly, as opposed to being the habit of a lunchtime.

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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  Panda on Fri 27 Apr - 19:03

mossman wrote:
Panda wrote:
The Crematorium was sealed and when Police checked the Seal had not been broken.

There is one theory that the Portugese have is that Madeleine' s body was thrown from nearby cliffs, quite feasible. If the McCanns still had the Buggy
Madeleines body could have been hidden in the Tennis bag and while everyone else was searching Gerry could have slipped away un-noticed and
wheeled the buggy to the Cliffs, or carried it to the Cliffs.

If on the other hand Madeleine WAS abducted by someone who kept watch on 5a, saw Gerry leave at about 9.10PM , went into 5a via the Patio Doors
chloroformed Madeleine walked out with her the way he came and took her to a Car parked nearby. Since Oldfield only listened at the Window and Kate
went into 5a at 10pm the Abductor would have had a good start before the Police Arrived.


When I wondered if Madeleine was in actual fact taken that night, I felt that the only way in which this would have been done is if the McCanns were not telling the truth on the frequency of their checks. If she had been left alone for an hour or more it would throw a whole different light on the matter in terms of opportunity for the abductor. The Tapas group could very well have walked out those doors at 8.30 - 9.00 and not returned until 10.00, BUT:-


This will never explain the dogs findings . If you really wanted to push the boat out and say somebody brought a dead body with them in a bag on holiday before the McCanns used the apartment, ok, that will explain the cadaver alert. Then Madeleine had a nose bleed so that explains blood alert. However, then we have to explain the car, the key, the clothes, cuddlecat. How can we do that ? Were both dogs having a crazy day, whereas up to then they were reliable, suddenly both of them got it so wrong on all counts. I just cannot accept that.

Obviously there is much than this to question, that list is endless, no point in re-hasing it here. I have tried and tried to see a way in which she may have been taken, in the interests of fairness. I have got to say I cannot raise one doubt that would lead to supporting the abduction theory.

Where is she ? How I would love to know poor pet. But there are two things I cannot wipe from my mind, that sit there all of the time and niggle at me:

1. The phrase "they have taken her" if this is what Kate said. This means more than she has gone.

2. David Payne, the shadow in the background all week. Matt, Russell, Jane, they all came under the line of fire for various different reasons. Payne not so. It was he who went off straight after the alarm was raised and searched at the beach and between the rocks all on his own. This was before the police arrived and the few out searching would have assumed they were looking for a girl alone. They would not necessarily have been looking for someone doing something out of the ordinary. Too focused on a lost little girl.

Unexpected issues brought him to the forefront in this, Yvonne Martin and the Gaspers. But as a character in the play that was in PDL, he had a silent role, hidden in the background. He was too "clean" particularly that Thursday night, he does not even seem to have left the table to use the toilet. It is nearly over emphasised that he did not move from the table, without it ever being said out loud, iykwim.

I think Dr Gaspar read too much into the finger licking , if I had witnessed David Payne do it again I would ask him outright what it signified.
This is a mature Doctor for goodness sake. Only when she learned of Madeleine's disappearance two years later did she go to LP on 17th May and make a statement. Neither do I believe the Group was into pedophilia.

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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  mumbles on Fri 27 Apr - 19:04

Not Born Yesterday wrote:I understand that the Catholic Church prefers that bodies are not cremated but then of course it's not happy about IVF treatment either.......

Plenty of Catholics are cremated these days. It is no longer considered taboo.

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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  Not Born Yesterday on Fri 27 Apr - 19:08

Noted with thanks Mumbles. I'm an atheist, thank God!

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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  whatsupdoc on Fri 27 Apr - 19:17

We don't know when Madeleine died. Dewi Lennard, that's @kikoratton on twitter, suggests she died on the first night of the holiday, in which case they had several days to plan and deal with a body.

I think if the creche records show that the entries were forged, then this shows that Madeleine did die on the first night. The body could have been moved to another location during the next 5 days.If Madelene Naylor did stand in for Madeleine , I think it is a possibility that the whole thing was preplanned. Seeing the McCann's giving the press interview on the Friday morning, they didn't look distraught at all. The could have had 5 days to get over the death. Kate had her script with even a few words of Portuguese included and Gerry did his town crier act from a piece of paper.

I heard that a person did take what they said was a dog to the pet crematorium in a bag which wasn't opened. It could have been Madeleine. The picture of the urn on the shelf makes me think she has been cremated.

A body could have been returned to the UK inside the blowup advert which was on the beach for a few days.

Let's face it, masons have contacts and one can get anything fixed so Madeleine could have been cremated in the UK.

Where ever Madeleine ended up is down to the disgraceful parenting of the McCanns.

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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  mumbles on Fri 27 Apr - 19:20

Not Born Yesterday wrote:Noted with thanks Mumbles. I'm an atheist, thank God!


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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  whatsupdoc on Fri 27 Apr - 19:21

mumbles wrote:
Not Born Yesterday wrote:Noted with thanks Mumbles. I'm an atheist, thank God!




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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  Guest on Fri 27 Apr - 19:27

whatsupdoc wrote:We don't know when Madeleine died. Dewi Lennard, that's @kikoratton on twitter, suggests she died on the first night of the holiday, in which case they had several days to plan and deal with a body.

I think if the creche records show that the entries were forged, then this shows that Madeleine did die on the first night. The body could have been moved to another location during the next 5 days.If Madelene Naylor did stand in for Madeleine , I think it is a possibility that the whole thing was preplanned. Seeing the McCann's giving the press interview on the Friday morning, they didn't look distraught at all. The could have had 5 days to get over the death. Kate had her script with even a few words of Portuguese included and Gerry did his town crier act from a piece of paper.

I heard that a person did take what they said was a dog to the pet crematorium in a bag which wasn't opened. It could have been Madeleine. The picture of the urn on the shelf makes me think she has been cremated.

A body could have been returned to the UK inside the blowup advert which was on the beach for a few days.

Let's face it, masons have contacts and one can get anything fixed so Madeleine could have been cremated in the UK.

Where ever Madeleine ended up is down to the disgraceful parenting of the McCanns.


I was with you right up to mention of Masons: Masons are not obliged to assist offenders within their ranks. Bad people do, though - and no doubt there are some bad people in the Masons, but they do bad things because they are bad, not because they are Masons.

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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  Guest on Fri 27 Apr - 19:28

whatsupdoc wrote:
mumbles wrote:
Not Born Yesterday wrote:Noted with thanks Mumbles. I'm an atheist, thank God!




And I'm a Polytheist, so Thank Gods

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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  whatsupdoc on Fri 27 Apr - 19:50

The End Is Nigh Fair comment. I used to work with many masons, about 200. There are good and bad people in many organisations and I haven't liked what I've seen going on.

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Re: Bring Me The Body

Post  Guest on Fri 27 Apr - 20:04

whatsupdoc wrote:The End Is Nigh Fair comment. I used to work with many masons, about 200. There are good and bad people in many organisations and I haven't liked what I've seen going on.


Stout fellow

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