Amaral V McCann trial

carlymichelle wrote:so they are going to court???

Do they have to take their children (Amelie, Sean and Madeleine) with them? Because they are suing Amaral too, with their (greedy) parents. (writ)

I always thought it was very strange that they included Maddie in all of this. If she is WOC, isn't it up to the judge to speak in her name?

If Madeleine is still a Ward of Court, the Parents are not her Guardians and I would have thought have no right to act on her behalf. I would have thought the High Court would represent her, so maybe once the McCanns
got the LP Files last year and the case was shelved the High Court is no longer Guardian.

Beattie wrote:If Madeleine is still a Ward of Court, the Parents are not her Guardians and I would have thought have no right to act on her behalf. I would have thought the High Court would represent her, so maybe once the McCanns
got the LP Files last year and the case was shelved the High Court is no longer Guardian.

Do they have to take the kids with them, as they are in the writ. (woc or not)

Weissnicht

I doubt it, maybe have to produce Birth Certificates, but at this stage I would assume Levy, their Lawyer would
do any talking, it is only a preliminary hearing where hopefully Amaral gets to put his side of the Story. It has
been Smethurst and Abreu advising the McCanns and we don"t know how good these Lawyers are. Not in the
same class as CR . If Amaral has his day in Court and satisfies the Judge that he said nothing to harm the
McCanns or their children, accused them of nothing, maybe the injunction will be lifted, it"s not just him, its the
Book Publishers and the Portugese firm that made the DVD

weissnicht wrote:

Beattie wrote:If Madeleine is still a Ward of Court, the Parents are not her Guardians and I would have thought have no right to act on her behalf. I would have thought the High Court would represent her, so maybe once the McCanns
got the LP Files last year and the case was shelved the High Court is no longer Guardian.

Do they have to take the kids with them, as they are in the writ. (woc or not)

Weiss nicht, no, it is very highly unlikely that they take their kids with them.
It would be against child protection really.
Child protectors would protest!
Imagine how confusing such a court-thing would be for S. and A.
And harmful.
All the allegations agains mummy and daddy (if there will be allegations)...

Beattie wrote:Lilemor,

I really don"t know. Here each party has their own Lawyer who presents the case in Court and the Judge
makes the decision or a Jury. I think the injunction was made by 1 Judge, but in a proper trial I think there
are three judges under Portugese Law, plus Juries.

It will take months before we get to Trial stage this is probably just a preliminary hearing so that Amaral can
have his say.

A trial where the defendant risks a prison sentence or the amount in dispute is high requires three judges.
I don't know the exact threshold but this trial will definitively require a collective of judges.

Lilemor wrote:

weissnicht wrote:

Beattie wrote:If Madeleine is still a Ward of Court, the Parents are not her Guardians and I would have thought have no right to act on her behalf. I would have thought the High Court would represent her, so maybe once the McCanns
got the LP Files last year and the case was shelved the High Court is no longer Guardian.

Do they have to take the kids with them, as they are in the writ. (woc or not)

Weiss nicht, no, it is very highly unlikely that they take their kids with them.
It would be against child protection really.
Child protectors would protest!
Imagine how confusing such a court-thing would be for S. and A.
And harmful.
All the allegations agains mummy and daddy (if there will be allegations)...

Of course it would be terrible for S and A.
It aready is.
But, after all, they are suing Amaral (with their parents). Do they have to be there? (what does the law say about that)

No, Weiss nicht.
I know what you mean.
But they, the kids, not REALLY sued Amaral.
They are much too young to do so.
The parents had to decide and they have the custody.
They decided to sue in the name of S. and A.
Which is different.
Children, aged like Sean and Amelie, can in no way decide if they want to sue.

MCXLIII wrote:

Beattie wrote:Lilemor,

I really don"t know. Here each party has their own Lawyer who presents the case in Court and the Judge
makes the decision or a Jury. I think the injunction was made by 1 Judge, but in a proper trial I think there
are three judges under Portugese Law, plus Juries.

It will take months before we get to Trial stage this is probably just a preliminary hearing so that Amaral can
have his say.

A trial where the defendant risks a prison sentence or the amount in dispute is high requires three judges.
I don't know the exact threshold but this trial will definitively require a collective of judges.

Thank you for the information.
A collective of judges would be fine I assume.

MCXLIII

Let"s just see how the McCanns cope in a Court of Law, no good Kate saying er, um, er um or Gerry threatening
a walk out if he is asked a difficult question.

Actually I wouldn"t mind going to Lisbon and sitting in the Visitors Gallery or whatever when the Trial starts,
if there was enough of us we could hire a Coach.!!!! Do you live anywhere near Lisbon?

Lilemor wrote:No, Weiss nicht.
I know what you mean.
But they, the kids, not REALLY sued Amaral.
They are much too young to do so.
The parents had to decide and they have the custody.
They decided to sue in the name of S. and A.
Which is different.
Children, aged like Sean and Amelie, can in no way decide if they want to sue.

Ok.

Now a different issue. Madeleine is suing too. She is WoC. Her legal guardian is an adult. Does she have to be there???
(she should, IMO)

Beattie wrote:I notice it was a Female judge who ordered the injunction, obviously swayed by the inclusion of Madeleine, Sean and Amelie and the "suffering" of the McCanns. Lets hope a more impartial Judge presides this time, at
least Amaral will have the opportunity to defend himself.

Do we know how much has been raised so far for Amaral"s Fund?

An interestingly sexist remark - surely not a suggestion that female judges are unable to be impartial.

And yes, it would be interesing to see how many people are supporting Amarals appeal against the injunction financially. I gather it will be announced in due course.

Weiss nicht,
it would be nice if Madeleine could be there...

But no.

I think her soul is not longer with us.

sans souci

Yes, it does come across as sexist but what I meant was Women are usually more compassionate than Men and the fact that the Judge ordered the immediate injunction without Amaral being able to defend himself is hardly
fairminded.

Beattie, I am unsure as to what your comments about female judges are really implying.

Are you saying that when children are involved, women judges cannot be fair minded? Are you suggesting that all women judges are incapable of fulfilling the role properly?

Or are you suggesting that this particular woman judge, in this case acted unfairly?

If the latter, I would be interested to know how you draw that conclusion as to the best of my knowledge the documentation and case work on which she based her judgement has NOT been released to the public.

Lilemor wrote:Weiss nicht,
it would be nice if Madeleine could be there...

But no.

I think her soul is not longer with us.

I agree.

But her legal guardian is still 'with us' so far as I know. I she doing something? Coming to court? Anything?
Madeleine is WoC, she have to. It's her job ! It's a legal issue.

jjp

From what I read the Mccanns wanted the Book and DVD banned and to my mind the Judge did act unfairly
in that she didn"t hear Amaral"s side of the story first. His Lawyer has made it plain that Amaral has never accused the McCanns of being complicit in Madeleine"s disappearance, but as a Detective with 26 years
experience he gives very valid reasons why he does not think there was an abduction. By ordering an immediate injunction it seems as though she has already taken the side of the McCanns even before the Trial.

For the McCanns to claim they and their children have been traumatised by the Book and DVD and that their
health has suffered and to try to get 1.2 million Euros is beyond the pale for me because we all know from the
Cutting Edge Docu that the Family are in fine health. I just hope they get their comeuppance on this and that
the Portugese Judges and Jury will see through them.

Beattie, without being able to access the documentation, or having any real understanding of the way the Portuguese legal system works, I am simply going to wait and see. I can't judge the judge without some real evidence.

jjp wrote:Beattie, without being able to access the documentation, or having any real understanding of the way the Portuguese legal system works, I am simply going to wait and see. I can't judge the judge without some real evidence.

Agreed, I read somewhere that the Portugese Judicial System was supposed to be the 5th most Democratic
in Europe, I think the case of Madeleine completely overwhelmed them and the World Wide interest put them
under a lot of pressure. Wasn"t it Ribiero who turned a blind eye to the McCanns employing Metodo 3 which created a secondary investigation supposed to not be allowed? How come Kennedy was able to attend a meeting with Portugese Detectives and Metodo 3?

Anyway, let"s hope the Trial is held in private and that hordes of Press don"t descend on Lisbon and create
more McCann mania.

If the McCann's lose this case and the ban is lifted, they are doomed. The book will become a best seller the world over.

If the McCann's win this case and the ban remains, they are doomed. The book will become the most sought after publication in the world.

Either way... They are doomed!

im only just getting with it, today is the 1st. Dec, any late news of whats happening/happened

Hiya tanzi, they don't have to be there until the 11th December.

It will be very interesting to see what happens

Just a quick note about another "abduction" which according to the parents took place in June in the north of France. Typhaine 5 disappeared according to her mother, in a street of Maubeuge, the mother who was sure it was an abduction and confident the little girl would be recovered soon. Today the police arrested her and her friend. They have recognised that the child died in the house ( accident or to severe trashing) and they buried the body in a wood. She apparently lied because she didn't want to loose the custody of her to other children. The police is trying to locate the body.