Re: MOODY"S CUTS PORTUGAL"S CREDIT RATING

**Panda** Wed 13 Jul - 11:32

Hammy wrote:
Panda wrote:...Socialism died a long time ago...

that's true but noone's told them yet and they continue to spend money they haven't got nor can repay back.

Yes, I know and what EU rules are being broken in this attempt to stop these Countries defaulting.?

**Panda** Wed 13 Jul - 12:05

This is interesting, a discussion on the EC crisis, apparently the EC Cabinet has no idea on how to cope with this crisis and trying to shoot the
Messenger, ie Moody"s when the problem is there is no EC procedure for this kind of problem. This analyst says because the EC is not taking firm action,
it is spooking the Bond Market. Contrary to public opinion, Germany has big Loans and is not immune to any fallout.

**Claudia79** Wed 13 Jul - 13:03

These idiots think that destroying the Euro will save the dollar. They're in for a surprise. Oh yes, they are. Can't wait.
There are still some deluded fools who think that ruining Europe's economies is a European problem. Domino, guys. Domino.

**Claudia79** Wed 13 Jul - 23:19

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/07/13/us-usa-ratings-moodys-idUSTRE76C6PT20110713

MOODY"S CUTS PORTUGAL"S CREDIT RATING - Page 2 49091

**Panda** Wed 13 Jul - 23:40

Claudia79 wrote:http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/07/13/us-usa-ratings-moodys-idUSTRE76C6PT20110713

Hi Claudia, There was a meeting with Bernanke this afternoon, he warned that cuts would have to be made but didn"t think the situation was as bad
as some thought and urged the Government to find a way of working together. He warned there were uncertain times ahead and said if it was necessary he would intervene .

**Claudia79** Thu 14 Jul - 0:23

Panda wrote:
Claudia79 wrote:http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/07/13/us-usa-ratings-moodys-idUSTRE76C6PT20110713

Hi Claudia, There was a meeting with Bernanke this afternoon, he warned that cuts would have to be made but didn"t think the situation was as bad
as some thought and urged the Government to find a way of working together. He warned there were uncertain times ahead and said if it was necessary he would intervene .

Oh, I'm up to date, Panda. Thanks. Difficult but interesting times ahead.

**Panda** Thu 14 Jul - 0:43

Claudia79 wrote:
Panda wrote:
Claudia79 wrote:http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/07/13/us-usa-ratings-moodys-idUSTRE76C6PT20110713

Hi Claudia, There was a meeting with Bernanke this afternoon, he warned that cuts would have to be made but didn"t think the situation was as bad
as some thought and urged the Government to find a way of working together. He warned there were uncertain times ahead and said if it was necessary he would intervene .

Oh, I'm up to date, Panda. Thanks. Difficult but interesting times ahead.

I don"t think the World has known anything like this, we"ve had two World Wars which mean"t hardship for many years after, but this is something quite different. The Middle East crisis, a population less willing to accept hardship because the Financial Crisis is the direct result of too much credit, greedy banks and poor Financial regulation...as you say, interesting times ahead.

**Claudia79** Thu 14 Jul - 1:12

Panda wrote:
Claudia79 wrote:
Panda wrote:
Claudia79 wrote:http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/07/13/us-usa-ratings-moodys-idUSTRE76C6PT20110713

Hi Claudia, There was a meeting with Bernanke this afternoon, he warned that cuts would have to be made but didn"t think the situation was as bad
as some thought and urged the Government to find a way of working together. He warned there were uncertain times ahead and said if it was necessary he would intervene .

Oh, I'm up to date, Panda. Thanks. Difficult but interesting times ahead.

I don"t think the World has known anything like this, we"ve had two World Wars which mean"t hardship for many years after, but this is something quite different. The Middle East crisis, a population less willing to accept hardship because the Financial Crisis is the direct result of too much credit, greedy banks and poor Financial regulation...as you say, interesting times ahead.

War times were terrible but people cold cont with their work to overcome their difficulties. Things have changed now. Many people want to work and can't find it. Add to that too much credit, as you rightly say, a big portion of speculation and voilá, a recipe for disaster. Until very recently thought to be a problem of 'those' countries and now seen as it should have always seen: something which can be extremely dangerous and highly contagious.

**Panda** Thu 14 Jul - 1:27

There"s a very good Book called Zeitgist, it"s on Youtube, get the original, not the second version. It"s quite fascinating and explains how from the
first Dollar printed, a debt was created. In 1928, a Guy called Bearnais, a nephew of Freud living in America created the idea of "consumerism", that which we desire, not what we need. American Companies loved the idea and that was the start of Debt and the throwawy Society.

**Claudia79** Thu 14 Jul - 1:55

Panda wrote:There"s a very good Book called Zeitgist, it"s on Youtube, get the original, not the second version. It"s quite fascinating and explains how from the
first Dollar printed, a debt was created. In 1928, a Guy called Bearnais, a nephew of Freud living in America created the idea of "consumerism", that which we desire, not what we need. American Companies loved the idea and that was the start of Debt and the throwawy Society.

Consumerism is something human. We all want to live better. We all want our children to have more than we had growing up and we actively encourage them to do their best to achieve it. The aggressive criticism of consumerism is (although understandable especially nowadays) a bit hypocritical because we contradict what we preach almost everyday. Like everything in life balance is the key. If we lived only with what we need, we don't even truly need electricity. Millions live without it. When my dad bought his first car his grandmother told him he was wasting money because he didn't need it. When I got my first mobile phone my aunt told my dad he was spoiling me (I was in my first year of Uni and almost turning nineteen). I catch myself telling my kids that their X Boxes and Wiis are a waste of money and a way to become stupid. That's the way we humans are. Hypocritical by nature. MOODY"S CUTS PORTUGAL"S CREDIT RATING - Page 2 Icon_flower

**Panda** Thu 14 Jul - 12:12

The consensus among Financial Gurus is that the EC has no idea how to cope with these problems because they have never had to face anything
similar. The Spanish and Greek Governments and Ireland have Junk Bond Status which means their debts will quadruple because they have to pay so
much more interest on borrowing and Bonds. Germany has refused to take the latest stress test which is very suspicious and maybe bears out what one
Analyst said yesterday, that Germany has substantial Bank Debts. They can"t afford to let these Countries leave the EU because the Euro would slide ,
affecting all the others. It"s a huge problem .

**Claudia79** Thu 14 Jul - 15:00

Panda wrote:The consensus among Financial Gurus is that the EC has no idea how to cope with these problems because they have never had to face anything
similar. The Spanish and Greek Governments and Ireland have Junk Bond Status which means their debts will quadruple because they have to pay so
much more interest on borrowing and Bonds. Germany has refused to take the latest stress test which is very suspicious and maybe bears out what one
Analyst said yesterday, that Germany has substantial Bank Debts. They can"t afford to let these Countries leave the EU because the Euro would slide ,
affecting all the others. It"s a huge problem .

They woke up late. It's quite simple, really. They thought until very recently (or at least they wanted the world to think) that the problem was only with 'those' countries which were believed to be the irresponsible ungovernable ones. It wasn't. It never was that simple. And now they are realising the extension of the problem. In short, they only started to give a damn when it became clearer so much more was at stake than the expandable small countries. Let's just hope it was not too late.

**Panda** Thu 14 Jul - 16:08

Hi Claudia,

The factors creating all these problems is lack of employment for the Citizens of these Countries so that borrowings can be paid back in a reasonably short time. America is facing a 9.2% unemployment figure and if the two Political parties don"t agree on the action to take by 2nd August their
Credit Rating will fall from Triple A, first time since 1917 !!! The Banks have to answer for most of the problem, too willing to lend, no proper
Government watchdog, new phones, televisions, Fashions etc all the things we don"t need to change every 6 months,it"s that consumerism thing again!

Sit tight, it"s going to be a bumpy ride MOODY"S CUTS PORTUGAL"S CREDIT RATING - Page 2 25346

MOODY"S CUTS PORTUGAL"S CREDIT RATING - Page 2 25346

**Claudia79** Thu 14 Jul - 16:18

Panda wrote:Hi Claudia,

The factors creating all these problems is lack of employment for the Citizens of these Countries so that borrowings can be paid back in a reasonably short time. America is facing a 9.2% unemployment figure and if the two Political parties don"t agree on the action to take by 2nd August their
Credit Rating will fall from Triple A, first time since 1917 !!! The Banks have to answer for most of the problem, too willing to lend, no proper
Government watchdog, new phones, televisions, Fashions etc all the things we don"t need to change every 6 months,it"s that consumerism thing again!

Sit tight, it"s going to be a bumpy ride

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/video/2011/jul/14/euro-crisis-song-video

**Panda** Thu 14 Jul - 16:32

Claudia79 wrote:
Panda wrote:Hi Claudia,

The factors creating all these problems is lack of employment for the Citizens of these Countries so that borrowings can be paid back in a reasonably short time. America is facing a 9.2% unemployment figure and if the two Political parties don"t agree on the action to take by 2nd August their
Credit Rating will fall from Triple A, first time since 1917 !!! The Banks have to answer for most of the problem, too willing to lend, no proper
Government watchdog, new phones, televisions, Fashions etc all the things we don"t need to change every 6 months,it"s that consumerism thing again!

Sit tight, it"s going to be a bumpy ride

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/video/2011/jul/14/euro-crisis-song-video

Nice one Claudia......isn"t this just what I have been saying. MOODY"S CUTS PORTUGAL"S CREDIT RATING - Page 2 294124

**Claudia79** Thu 14 Jul - 17:57

Panda wrote:
Claudia79 wrote:
Panda wrote:Hi Claudia,

The factors creating all these problems is lack of employment for the Citizens of these Countries so that borrowings can be paid back in a reasonably short time. America is facing a 9.2% unemployment figure and if the two Political parties don"t agree on the action to take by 2nd August their
Credit Rating will fall from Triple A, first time since 1917 !!! The Banks have to answer for most of the problem, too willing to lend, no proper
Government watchdog, new phones, televisions, Fashions etc all the things we don"t need to change every 6 months,it"s that consumerism thing again!

Sit tight, it"s going to be a bumpy ride

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/video/2011/jul/14/euro-crisis-song-video

Nice one Claudia......isn"t this just what I have been saying.

Specifically love the don't think it can't happen to you part. Could have written it myself. MOODY"S CUTS PORTUGAL"S CREDIT RATING - Page 2 294124

**Badboy** Thu 14 Jul - 18:06

let me try
WE DON'T NEED ANY EUROS.LA LA LA LA
ONLY SOME JUROS TO DO THE TOURO la la la la
HEY CAESAR,LEAVE THOSE SLIDOS ALONE
ALL IN ALL IT ANOTHER MESS IN THE ALL

**Panda** Thu 14 Jul - 18:14

Badboy wrote:let me try
WE DON'T NEED ANY EUROS.LA LA LA LA
ONLY SOME JUROS TO DO THE TOURO
HEY CAESAR,LEAVE THOSE SLIDOS ALONE
ALL IN ALL IT ANOTHER MESS IN THE ALL

MOODY"S CUTS PORTUGAL"S CREDIT RATING - Page 2 307691

Don"t call us, we"ll call you!!!!........only kidding. MOODY"S CUTS PORTUGAL"S CREDIT RATING - Page 2 25346

**Badboy** Thu 14 Jul - 18:26

Panda wrote:
Badboy wrote:let me try
WE DON'T NEED ANY EUROS.LA LA LA LA
ONLY SOME JUROS TO DO THE TOURO
HEY CAESAR,LEAVE THOSE SLIDOS ALONE
ALL IN ALL IT ANOTHER MESS IN THE ALL

Don"t call us, we"ll call you!!!!........only kidding.

NOW WHERE IS MY MUSIC DEAL?

**Panda** Fri 15 Jul - 17:41

EC Banks fail stress test Portugal has a E38 million deficit , a Harvard Professor of Economics says it is inevitable that Greece will default, probably Ireland, Spain and Portugal will follow suit and they will leave the Common Market. This is in part due to the EC Committee have no experience in dealing with this kind of crisis . He reckons the Euro is the problem but the Europeans love the currency, so it will be a disorderly break up.

**Claudia79** Fri 15 Jul - 17:58

All the Portuguese banks tested passed the stress tests as expected.

ETA: 5 of the Spanish banks tested failed...

**Badboy** Fri 15 Jul - 18:29

LLOYDS,BARCLAYS AND I THINK RBS PASSED THE TEST.
DID SANTANDER PASSED?

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