Ukraine violence escalates

Panda wrote:

Marky wrote:

Panda wrote:Timoshenko is being tipped as the next Prime Minister, confined to a wheelchair after injuries sustained while spending 3 years in Jail because of her Politics, the Ukrainians have great respect for

don't think it was her politics that got her jailed but she's no better than the one who's just been couped.  

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2566299/Dont-fooled-angelic-looks-shes-ruthless-shes-corrupt-A-withering-portrait-Ukraines-saviour-EDWARD-LUCAS-Russia-expert-knows-well.html

Hi Marky, I was wondering why you havn't been posting, hope all is well with you and yours.

As for Timoshenko, she doesn't want to be PM but would probably accept some role in a new Parliament. I'm not sure that Putin will give up his hold on the Ukraine and I can well see the Ukrainians divided on who to support. Putin has his own problems with Kiev and Obama has warned him not to intervene.  I honestly have never known such a World Wide turmoil , it is like a Domino Effect, from Europe, the middle East. Far East, parts of Africa etc. Is there some dark force manipulating all this ???

fine thanks and you? i'd be surprised if putin is concerned about obama. ukraine could go the way of what was yugoslavia given the roughly equal split over europe or russia. putin will seek to protect russian interests and that includes that portion of the population if this starts to get nasty and if he does, obama will do nothing.

  

Obama has enough problems in America, Russia is Oil rich and can afford to lend 35 billion to the Ukraine and Putin wants to retain the Ukraine. However, there has been a lot of violence and bloodshed in the Ukraine and those seeking a new beginning may well outnumber the Russian speaking Ukrainians , it remains to be seen whether those that have fought for a new leadership appoint their own Government , not one that Putin wants.

Quite apart from the money aspect of it, and we all agree Ukraine is desperate for money. There are those who want to forge closer links with the west, and those who want to cling on to Russia. By and large they haven't spoken out yet. If their reaction is as violent and mindless as the pro-European lobby it could get very nasty indeed. There are so many aspects of it I think it impossible to predict with any accuracy. Putin's reaction for example, at the moment unknown, but The USA is already warning him against armed intervention. I don't think he will take to much notice of that.

The European union is itself not the democratic organisation it is supposed to be (not that it ever was) Even if the pro Europeans get their way, it may turn out to being careful what you wish for. In an interview the other night, a spokesman said tere was no question of turning the gas supply off Ukraine, but it has been threatened before now.

katertaif wrote:Quite apart from the money aspect of it, and we all agree Ukraine is desperate for money. There are those who want to forge closer links with the west, and those who want to cling on to Russia. By and large they haven't spoken out yet. If their reaction is as violent and mindless as the pro-European lobby it could get very nasty indeed. There are so many aspects of it I think it impossible to predict with any accuracy. Putin's reaction for example, at the moment unknown, but The USA is already warning him against armed intervention. I don't think he will take to much notice of that.

The European union is itself not the democratic organisation it is supposed to be (not that it ever was) Even if the pro Europeans get their way, it may turn out to being careful what you wish for. In an interview the other night, a spokesman said tere was no question of turning the gas supply off Ukraine, but it has been threatened before now.

Morning katertaif....latest news is there is a demonstration in the Crimea area against any breakaway from Russia. It is peaceful at the moment but who knows where it will lead.??? Have you noticed Angela Merkel seems to have taken over all the International affairs on behalf of the EU? I don't think Obama will intervene , nor should Britain, but if the majority in the Ukraine vote again to join the EU it is because they desperately need financial support which the EU and IMF can offer

Good morning Panda

No I had not seen the news about demonstrations in the Crimea. My government has kept me hard at it all morning. I can't say I'm surprised though.

Yes, the EU and the IMF can offer the financial help they need, but for how long can we go on throwing money at countries who want to join purely for what they can get out of us? We are borrowing that money, and having to pay back at interest. We may be the 6th largest economy in the world, but what with the national disgrace of food banks, and the flooding, we are not much better off ourselves.

You are 110% correct when you say the US should not get involved militarily, it is difficult to see how they can anyway. Russia controls the entry to the Black Sea so short of rocket attacks, or carrier borne aircraft, either of which would send the balloon up with a vengeance I think it's all hot air on Obama's part. As for us getting involved we don't have the armed forces any more to fight off a determined attack by a gang of Teddy bears

This is the latest News. A demonstration in Simferopol in the Crimea started by those who want to retain the Russian Language has increased by those who want ties with Europe. At the moment it appears Putin has not made comment
but there is a Russian naval Base in Sebastapol which can be removed if the situation deteriorates according to Reporters on the ground. Nobody wants to see a Civil War in the Ukraine.

Panda wrote:Nobody wants to see a Civil War in the Ukraine.

oh i don't know. putin might find it or at least the very threat of it, much to his advantage.

  

You may not be far wrong in that assessment Marky

Marky wrote:

Panda wrote:Nobody wants to see a Civil War in the Ukraine.

oh i don't know. putin might find it or at least the very threat of it, much to his advantage.

  

Marky , I think it was Putin who started all this. When the Ukrainian Government applied to join the EU Putin didn't like that at all and probably threatened the PM to withdraw the application or he would not lend any money. This started a backlash in the Ukraine and a lot of blood was shed and damage done.I think it might end in a Civil War and another Country will have it's infastructure destroyed and many lives will be lost.

http://news.sky.com/story/1218041/crimea-armed-men-seize-parliament-building
 
Apparently they are armed with Kalashnikov rifles

Just reported, Russian Ministry has put Fighter Jets on alert along it's Western Border!!!

Panda wrote:http://news.sky.com/story/1218041/crimea-armed-men-seize-parliament-building
 
Apparently they are armed with Kalashnikov rifles

Just reported, Russian Ministry has put Fighter Jets on alert along it's Western Border!!!

you can buy a kalashnikov on any street corner in that region of the world. oh, and most of north and central africa come to think of it.

  

Marky wrote:

Panda wrote:http://news.sky.com/story/1218041/crimea-armed-men-seize-parliament-building
 
Apparently they are armed with Kalashnikov rifles

Just reported, Russian Ministry has put Fighter Jets on alert along it's Western Border!!!

you can buy a kalashnikov on any street corner in that region of the world. oh, and most of north and central africa come to think of it.

  

Morning marky, just confirmed that the deposed President is staying in a Hotel in Moscow........don't tell me Putin has not intervened and they are not Russian rifles. The deposed President, just reported, has asked Putin to guarantee his safety. It is starting to look very ugly , how will the population who fought and died for Independence react

Panda wrote:

Marky wrote:

Panda wrote:http://news.sky.com/story/1218041/crimea-armed-men-seize-parliament-building
 
Apparently they are armed with Kalashnikov rifles

Just reported, Russian Ministry has put Fighter Jets on alert along it's Western Border!!!

you can buy a kalashnikov on any street corner in that region of the world. oh, and most of north and central africa come to think of it.

  

Morning marky, just confirmed that the deposed President is staying in a Hotel in Moscow........don't tell me Putin has not intervened and they are not Russian rifles. The deposed President, just reported, has asked Putin to guarantee his safety. It is starting to look very ugly , how will the population who fought and died for Independence react

who knows but those who started the chain reaction that resulted in the coup of a president who was elected by a clear majority just because he didn't want to do want to do what they wanted may be about to realise what they have unleashed. putin appears to be about to flex his muscle to protect russia's interests under the guise of protecting the ukrainian population who wish to align themselves with russia and there's nothing anyone will do about it. my guess is the country will splinter much like yugoslavia did.

  

How many will die and how much damage to the infrastructure in the meantime. The World has gone mad.!!!

HE OPENLY BOASTED ABOUT HIS CORRUPTION TO OTHER HEADS OF STATE,HE SEEMED TO BE ONLY INTERESTED IN MONEY.

Badboy wrote:HE OPENLY BOASTED ABOUT HIS CORRUPTION TO OTHER HEADS OF STATE,HE SEEMED TO BE ONLY INTERESTED IN MONEY.

 
Putin will let him stay in Russia and pick his brains about security etc in the Ukraine etc Badboy, they must have been in contact before the President left, making sure he took all his valuables with him.

Panda wrote:

Badboy wrote:HE OPENLY BOASTED ABOUT HIS CORRUPTION TO OTHER HEADS OF STATE,HE SEEMED TO BE ONLY INTERESTED IN MONEY.

 
Putin will let him stay in Russia and pick his brains  about security etc in the Ukraine etc Badboy, they must have been in contact before the President left, making sure he took all his valuables with him.

they're all corrupt that part of the world. always have been always will.   

My Grandmother on my Father's side was Russian and fled during the 1917 Revolution ending up in Wales of all places   I remember visiting her, not very often because I never understood what she was saying, she was tiny.

Marky wrote:

Panda wrote:

Badboy wrote:HE OPENLY BOASTED ABOUT HIS CORRUPTION TO OTHER HEADS OF STATE,HE SEEMED TO BE ONLY INTERESTED IN MONEY.

 
Putin will let him stay in Russia and pick his brains  about security etc in the Ukraine etc Badboy, they must have been in contact before the President left, making sure he took all his valuables with him.

they're all corrupt that part of the world. always have been always will.   

Really? There's a whole part of the world where everybody is corrupt?

Claudia79 wrote:

Marky wrote:

Panda wrote:

Badboy wrote:HE OPENLY BOASTED ABOUT HIS CORRUPTION TO OTHER HEADS OF STATE,HE SEEMED TO BE ONLY INTERESTED IN MONEY.

 
Putin will let him stay in Russia and pick his brains  about security etc in the Ukraine etc Badboy, they must have been in contact before the President left, making sure he took all his valuables with him.

they're all corrupt that part of the world. always have been always will.   

Really? There's a whole part of the world where everybody is corrupt?

oh, yeah.  

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=world%20corruption&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CAsQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.transparency.org%2Fcpi2013%2Fresults&ei=sKMQU4DSD8ejhgf_loEI&usg=AFQjCNH7Tq0c6ZdAJj6pJjtqm6f4B4Q-lQ

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index

Marky wrote:

Claudia79 wrote:

Marky wrote:

Panda wrote:

Badboy wrote:HE OPENLY BOASTED ABOUT HIS CORRUPTION TO OTHER HEADS OF STATE,HE SEEMED TO BE ONLY INTERESTED IN MONEY.

 
Putin will let him stay in Russia and pick his brains  about security etc in the Ukraine etc Badboy, they must have been in contact before the President left, making sure he took all his valuables with him.

they're all corrupt that part of the world. always have been always will.   

Really? There's a whole part of the world where everybody is corrupt?

oh, yeah.  

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=world%20corruption&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CAsQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.transparency.org%2Fcpi2013%2Fresults&ei=sKMQU4DSD8ejhgf_loEI&usg=AFQjCNH7Tq0c6ZdAJj6pJjtqm6f4B4Q-lQ

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index

Wow, I'm amazed. Now you really convinced me. Never in my life did I imagine that rankings could be so persuasive in terms of evaluating whole chunks of planet earth and its citizens. Not to mention Wiki, of course, a few steps above God.
Boy, am I happy my late grandmother was not Russian or I would be now desperate to get rid of the 25% of the corrupt me.