More Sky News.

Portuguese air force helicopter used in Madeleine probe
Last updated Thu 8 May 2014

http://www.itv.com/news/update/2014-05-08/portuguese-air-force-helicopter-used-in-madeleine-probe/

That's good.

Now Gezza will know that Portugal has an air force as well as a navy ...

LJC wrote:

tanszi wrote:LJC I feel differently.  i do not think that police would be granted search warrants for burglars houses in the UK which are not proved to be linked to a childs abduction.  You say that they had a large number of persons of interest but have whittled them down.  Bearing in mind the headlines about who they wanted to interview and why, it doesn't seem that they had much to whittle down.  its all spin to try and justify the massive amount of money being spent.  there has never been a case where the UK police actively gave a running commentary to the media and public about what was happening, the suspects they had and how many arrests are imminent and nothing happening.  I have a  very different view on what the UK police want.  Surely the way forward has already been agreed with the sites of interest that are going to be looked at with radar and excavated, oh and weren't dogs mentioned.  Are you sure the people on the ground discuss and agree what is to be done where, surely they will only carry out the investigations that have been agreed by the AG in Portugal.

One link here and one link there does not amount of proof. Links are certain chains of events which may form a pattern of activity in an enquiry. Where a pattern is identified the link strengthens.   SY may have to do more work around these 3 individuals to try to maximise the information they already have about them before the Portuguese will agree to searches of their homes.

So far as the whittle down of suspects is concerned, I think there would be other people of interest who are on file but perhaps its about prioritising them in order of interest.  At the moment these 3 people are more of a priority for SY.

I think yes, authorisations to carry out certain work will have been acquired beforehand but this will not be the last visit to Portugal made by UK detectives and part of their time in Portugal will involve discussing future strategies and I do believe these 3 suspects will form a basis for discussions.

Hello LJC

Can you please take a look at the photographs of the inside of the McCanns apartment and say why Andy Redwood wants to search the homes of 3 burglars, when there is no proof a burglary or even an abduction took place.

Maybe you can also explain, why Andy Redwood, will not make the McCanns his number one suspects? Unless I've been missing something, from the time I followed this case 7yrs ago, which was the day the news broke about Madeleine's disappearance, I can only see two people who are responsible for Madeleine's disappearance. Also their behaviour since Madeleine was supposedly discovered missing by her mother, is not that of parents whose child has been abducted.

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id155.html

I've studied the photographs in the link above and nowhere can I see evidence of a burglary or an abduction. Maybe you can point out evidence of a burglary and or an abduction, which I have obviously missed.

kitti wrote:The 'burglars' aren't being interviewed and their house or bank account won't be looked into because the PJ know the 'burglars' had nothing to do with Madeleines disappearance, simple as that.

Exactly!

After all this time and EXPENSE has SY even bothered to read the official Portuguese files? If they have, their reading comprehension skills are nil.

interested wrote:After all this time and EXPENSE has SY even bothered to read the official Portuguese files?  If they have, their reading comprehension skills are nil.

Hi Interested

Redwood and his team are an embarrassment. Redwood has made snide comments about the PJ's ability to investigate this case properly, when he told the media, that he had found vital information in the PJ files, that the PJ had missed. If Redwood had half a brain, he would have realised that everything in the PJ files, is the result of the PJ's investigation.

The PJ have acted with dignity, while these comments have been made by Redwood and the media. They have proved, that when it came to investigating this case, they were the better people. Redwood didn't want the original team of PJ investigators on board, he thought that a new team, would follow his lead, when they began to investigate. How wrong he was.

The new team of PJ investigators, can investigate without interference from the Portuguese and British Government. No one knows what stage of the investigation, this new team are at, because unlike Redwood, they are keeping 'shtum'.   

The PJ have managed to work out that burglars dont steal children.

SY are pathetic.

Lioned wrote:The PJ have managed to work out that burglars dont steal children.

SY are pathetic.

They have an impossible task - to find a credible non-McCann scapegoat

I've read the McCanns are complaining that media interference is "compounding our distress". They are now slamming the media after the prayer service at the War Memorial on Saturday (complete with microphone) didn't attract the numbers they anticipated. Oh, the irony; while the McCanns and their named and unnamed "sources" were feeding the press by manipulating uninformed public opinion and the cash was rolling in all was well. What's that called?....the tables have turned maybe.

interested wrote:I've read the McCanns are complaining that media interference is "compounding our distress".  They are now slamming the media after the prayer service at the War Memorial on Saturday (complete with microphone) didn't attract the numbers they anticipated.  Oh, the irony; while the McCanns and their named and unnamed "sources" were feeding the press by manipulating uninformed public opinion and the cash was rolling in all was well.  What's that called?....the tables have turned maybe.

Oh dear, l think they may have completely lost the plot   

I bet they are distressed, very very distressed indeed. Nothing to do with the media reporting though. More to do with the work that may be going on in Portugal. More to do with the fact that they have been trying for weeks now to find out what the PJ are at and have failed miserably.

Distress for their missing daughter ? I doubt it.

Get those pink trainers on Kate and go for a jog with Gerry. That solved everything back in 2007, those carefree, happy, jogging days. Mind the dogs though, them pesky animals could be waiting in the shadows waiting to pounce.

I've just read the Sky News (online) report. It says: "The UK police were also said to be discussing their request to interview eight witnesses they believe could still have vital clues to the mystery." I take that to mean the UK police are still discussing their OWN request. And who would the eight witnesses be since the "suspect" burglars are off the list? Hmmmmmm!

I was thinking about who the eight witnesses were. I looked up the Smith family and I wonder if it could be them. There were nine of them the youngest was only four so they wouldn't be interviewed so that leaves eight.

MaryB wrote:I was thinking about who the eight witnesses were.  I looked up the Smith family and I wonder if it could be them.  There were nine of them the youngest was only four so they wouldn't be interviewed so that leaves eight.  

The Smith family are Irish so no negotiation with Portuguese would be necessary. Don't tell me the Irish are being uncooperative as well.

kitti wrote:The 'burglars' aren't being interviewed and their house or bank account won't be looked into because the PJ know the 'burglars' had nothing to do with Madeleines disappearance, simple as that.

It is not the PJ's decision. It's a judge's. And if there is nothing linking the 'persons of interest' to the Madeleine case, the the judge obviously couldn't allow for their houses or banks accounts to be investigated. We can't barge into people's houses and snoop in their finances without reason.

Claudia79 wrote:

kitti wrote:The 'burglars' aren't being interviewed and their house or bank account won't be looked into because the PJ know the 'burglars' had nothing to do with Madeleines disappearance, simple as that.

It is not the PJ's decision. It's a judge's. And if there is nothing linking the 'persons of interest' to the Madeleine case, the the judge obviously couldn't allow for their houses or banks accounts to be investigated. We can't barge into people's houses and snoop in their finances without reason.

I have said this elsewhere and i dont think anyone with two brain cells could possibly think different.Which is why if this had come from Andy at SY i consider him to have less than two brain cells or he is just messing around.It is fundamental.

i agree Claudia and Lioned why on earth would Redwood go to the Portuguese people he is meeting with and discuss their request to interview other eight people. doesn't the man understand that the person who makes the decision is the Judge. if this is true Redwood is an obnoxious Brit thinking they can get things done without going through the usual channels.

They know very well what the rules are.

That is why all this bollux in the press is just that.

The agenda is to look like they are doing something and deflect attention from the mccanns.

Most people who buy the red tops will believe it.

I read NSY want to take CSI blood and cadaver dogs (allegedly better trained than the original 'hurtful and unhelpful' ones). No way would I trust any CSI dogs Operation Grange hustle up. Hopefully the PJ know what conniving liars they're up against, and will insist on their own blood and cadaver dogs being used.

pennylane wrote:I read NSY want to take CSI blood and cadaver dogs (allegedly better trained than the original 'hurtful and unhelpful' ones). No way would I trust any CSI dogs Operation Grange hustle up.  Hopefully the PJ know what conniving liars they're up against, and will insist on their own blood and cadaver dogs being used.

And off course these 'much better' dogs will be taken into 5a and find.......................

.......................

Nothing !

Not even the faintest trace of old seabass.


And the mccann cleansing will continue with a little more haste in an effort to relieve them of the awful torment being inflicted by the nasty press !

Lioned wrote:

pennylane wrote:I read NSY want to take CSI blood and cadaver dogs (allegedly better trained than the original 'hurtful and unhelpful' ones). No way would I trust any CSI dogs Operation Grange hustle up.  Hopefully the PJ know what conniving liars they're up against, and will insist on their own blood and cadaver dogs being used.

And off course these 'much better' dogs will be taken into 5a and find.......................

.......................

Nothing !  

Not even the faintest trace of old seabass.


And the mccann cleansing will continue with a little more haste in an effort to relieve them of the awful torment being inflicted by the nasty press !

Yes, the whooshing of the original blood and cadaver dog evidence by a 'far superior' set of mutts.  Methinks DCI Redwood has that criteria firmly in his sights.

kathybelle wrote:

LJC wrote:

tanszi wrote:LJC I feel differently.  i do not think that police would be granted search warrants for burglars houses in the UK which are not proved to be linked to a childs abduction.  You say that they had a large number of persons of interest but have whittled them down.  Bearing in mind the headlines about who they wanted to interview and why, it doesn't seem that they had much to whittle down.  its all spin to try and justify the massive amount of money being spent.  there has never been a case where the UK police actively gave a running commentary to the media and public about what was happening, the suspects they had and how many arrests are imminent and nothing happening.  I have a  very different view on what the UK police want.  Surely the way forward has already been agreed with the sites of interest that are going to be looked at with radar and excavated, oh and weren't dogs mentioned.  Are you sure the people on the ground discuss and agree what is to be done where, surely they will only carry out the investigations that have been agreed by the AG in Portugal.

One link here and one link there does not amount of proof. Links are certain chains of events which may form a pattern of activity in an enquiry. Where a pattern is identified the link strengthens.   SY may have to do more work around these 3 individuals to try to maximise the information they already have about them before the Portuguese will agree to searches of their homes.

So far as the whittle down of suspects is concerned, I think there would be other people of interest who are on file but perhaps its about prioritising them in order of interest.  At the moment these 3 people are more of a priority for SY.

I think yes, authorisations to carry out certain work will have been acquired beforehand but this will not be the last visit to Portugal made by UK detectives and part of their time in Portugal will involve discussing future strategies and I do believe these 3 suspects will form a basis for discussions.

Hello LJC

Can you please take a look at the photographs of the inside of the McCanns apartment and say why Andy Redwood wants to search the homes of 3 burglars, when there is no proof a burglary or even an abduction took place.

Maybe you can also explain, why Andy Redwood, will not make the McCanns his number one suspects? Unless I've been missing something, from the time I followed this case 7yrs ago, which was the day the news broke about Madeleine's disappearance, I can only see two people who are responsible for Madeleine's disappearance. Also their behaviour since Madeleine was supposedly discovered missing by her mother, is not that of parents whose child has been abducted.  

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id155.html

I've studied the photographs in the link above and nowhere can I see evidence of a burglary or an abduction. Maybe you can point out evidence of a burglary and or an abduction, which I have obviously missed.

Well no break in required as the doors were unlocked. And if there is no sign of an abduction, how did the McCanns do it? Surely parents can be abductors too? If they carted her off they made it look like an abduction. Or did they get someone else to cart her off perhaps through unlocked doors? Or did a burglar enter through unlocked doors and suffocate her to stop her screaming and then cart her off back through unlocked doors.

Who knows. All we are told is no evidence of this, no evidence of that. But I don't necessarily buy into that. I don't buy into the apartment was so clean there was no DNA. How could that be, given so many entered the apartment to look for her? Deep cleaning on that scale, to clean off every trace of completely everyone, would take ages and we saw the forensic people there early on 4th May with their brushes and they arrived after the apartment had been sealed and we are told the apartment was sealed off as soon as possible.

DNA must have been plentiful; however it must be very hard to determine if there is rogue DNA, given all the people that trampled all over the apartment in the hour/s afterwards but if the 'tramplers' DNA has been identified, plus DNA from the family identified, it leaves other DNA possibly from others unknown and its that DNA that will be of interest to the police. If they have samples from others unknown then its a case of trying to find a match to it, but its a laborious process trying to get the hit from the database of known criminals or trying to get the hit from new samples from new criminals who are not yet on the database.

So, who knows what SY may find by a search of homes of burglars. 7 long years have passed but there may possibly be traces of hair from Madeleine on an old unwashed jacket for instance.

These are ex employees of Ocean Club, who are now known to be criminals who burgle, and their phones pinged in the area that very same night we are told, so I think it certainly warrants further investigation if only to rule them out.

I feel SY are ruling no one in and no one out. I don't think Kate and Gerry are as safe as SY give the impression they are and they are also looking at others unknown as well.

Lioned wrote:

Claudia79 wrote:

kitti wrote:The 'burglars' aren't being interviewed and their house or bank account won't be looked into because the PJ know the 'burglars' had nothing to do with Madeleines disappearance, simple as that.

It is not the PJ's decision. It's a judge's. And if there is nothing linking the 'persons of interest' to the Madeleine case, the the judge obviously couldn't allow for their houses or banks accounts to be investigated. We can't barge into people's houses and snoop in their finances without reason.

I have said this elsewhere and i dont think anyone with two brain cells could possibly think different.Which is why if this had come from Andy at SY i consider him to have less than two brain cells or he is just messing around.It is fundamental.

I would love it if these latest developments led to the case being solved although I don't believe it will. However, as important as a missing child case is, not all is fair. And search people houses and bank accounts and interview them if there is zilch linking them to the case is not only unfair but it also breaches their rights. That's why it must be a judge to decide. And the judge allowed what he/she thought was right and refused what he/she didn't.

tanszi wrote:i agree Claudia and Lioned why on earth would Redwood go to the Portuguese people he is meeting with and discuss their request to interview other eight people.  doesn't the man understand that the person who makes the decision is the Judge.  if this is true Redwood is an obnoxious Brit thinking they can get things done without going through the usual channels.

He can go and discuss whatever he wants. He just has to provide the authorities with motives and reasons. If he finds them, I'm sure any judge will allow diligences to go ahead.

Claudia79 wrote:

Lioned wrote:

Claudia79 wrote:

kitti wrote:The 'burglars' aren't being interviewed and their house or bank account won't be looked into because the PJ know the 'burglars' had nothing to do with Madeleines disappearance, simple as that.

It is not the PJ's decision. It's a judge's. And if there is nothing linking the 'persons of interest' to the Madeleine case, the the judge obviously couldn't allow for their houses or banks accounts to be investigated. We can't barge into people's houses and snoop in their finances without reason.

I have said this elsewhere and i dont think anyone with two brain cells could possibly think different.Which is why if this had come from Andy at SY i consider him to have less than two brain cells or he is just messing around.It is fundamental.

I would love it if these latest developments led to the case being solved although I don't believe it will. However, as important as a missing child case is, not all is fair. And search people houses and bank accounts and interview them if there is zilch linking them to the case is not only unfair but it also breaches their rights. That's why it must be a judge to decide. And the judge allowed what he/she thought was right and refused what he/she didn't.

This is where I have the biggest problem, anyone with half a brain, or two brain cells, only has to look at the evidence, read the Tapas statements, watch the video's with Eddie and Keela etc, and surely they must come to the conclusion all is not well in the state of Denmark, yet the Met insist that the McCann's are poor innocent wee souls. I have a few police friends one working in London, and nothing could convince her that the McCann's are innocent, another police friend in Oxford is the same, he says all the police in Britain think the McCann's guilty, guard in Ireland I have spoken to a few, they feel the same way, yet, yet, the Met cannot see this. How, Why!!

I am with you Claudia, I don't believe this case, recent accounts or otherwise will be solved, seven years of watching, waiting, hoping, from the Mirror forums onwards, to finally well over a year ago deciding to stop with the agony, and just look at the forums when something is happening, perhaps too many disappointments, to much hope dashed, tarnishing of the soul.

I want justice so badly, justice for Mr Amaral, and his police force, for the Portuguese people, for Madeleine, her little body to be found, brought home, a proper burial, and people who love and cared for her to weep at her grave, big sigh, its all so very sad, and cruel. How on earth have those two got away with this for so long.

Hear, hear, Ireland!