Greece will not default

ITIS BEING SAID THAT THE NOS IN THE REFERUNDUM ARE AHEAD 61% TO 39% YESES

GREECE HAS DEFINATELY VOTED NO IN THE REFERENDUM

Angelina wrote:

Badboy wrote:FUEL AND FOOD ARE IN SHORT SUPPLY AS GREECE GOES TO VOTE.

It seems that some Greeks believe (or pretend to) that a "no" vote is going to make the creditors change their minds and put further offers on the table.   I doubt it somehow but.........

ETA...I have a feeling that ordinary people are being duped into playing some sort of brinkmanship without them knowing it

That is exactly what it is Angelina, Brinkmanship. Sooner or later they will cobble up a form of words which while sounding grand and no doubt deeply eloquent, will mean nothing at. all Neither side will get exactly what it wants but the result will be that Greece can stay in the eurozone, and can continue lightening the pockets of the other member states, which was the intention all along. The real trouble being when the other members want their loans "forgiving" When the at the moment the rich north have restructured years of neglect and mal administration of the southern members. and beggared ourselves in the process will they remember and rush to our aid. Somehow, as my wife would put it "I hae my doots"

FRANCE AND GERMANY ARE TO HAVE A MEETING TOMORROW,WONDER WHATS GOING TO HAPPEN.

katertaif wrote:

Angelina wrote:

Badboy wrote:FUEL AND FOOD ARE IN SHORT SUPPLY AS GREECE GOES TO VOTE.

It seems that some Greeks believe (or pretend to) that a "no" vote is going to make the creditors change their minds and put further offers on the table.   I doubt it somehow but.........

ETA...I have a feeling that ordinary people are being duped into playing some sort of brinkmanship without them knowing it

That is exactly what it is Angelina,  Brinkmanship. Sooner or later they will cobble  up a form of words which while sounding grand and no doubt deeply eloquent,  will mean nothing  at. all Neither side will get exactly what it wants but the  result will be that  Greece can stay in the eurozone, and can continue lightening the pockets of the other member states, which was the intention all  along. The real trouble being when the other members want their loans "forgiving" When the at the moment the rich north have restructured years of neglect and mal administration of the southern members. and beggared ourselves in the process will they remember and rush to our aid. Somehow, as my wife would put it "I hae my doots"

As a Portuguese citizen you make me sick. Your ridiculous superiority feelings and your us vs them/ we vs they view of the world is everything that is wrong with it and is exactly why there are so many people hating each other.

SOME ARE BLAMING THE BANKS LIKE GOLDMAN SACHS FOR COOKING THE BOOKS AND/OR CREATIVE ACCOUNTANCY SO GREECE WOULDN'T BREACH THE 3% DEFICIT RULE OF EU.
SOME ARE SPECULATING THAT ITALY,PORTUGAL AND SPAIN MAY HAVE TO PAY MORE ON THEIR BONDS/DEBTS.

Claudia79 wrote:

katertaif wrote:

Angelina wrote:

Badboy wrote:FUEL AND FOOD ARE IN SHORT SUPPLY AS GREECE GOES TO VOTE.

It seems that some Greeks believe (or pretend to) that a "no" vote is going to make the creditors change their minds and put further offers on the table.   I doubt it somehow but.........

ETA...I have a feeling that ordinary people are being duped into playing some sort of brinkmanship without them knowing it

That is exactly what it is Angelina,  Brinkmanship. Sooner or later they will cobble  up a form of words which while sounding grand and no doubt deeply eloquent,  will mean nothing  at. all Neither side will get exactly what it wants but the  result will be that  Greece can stay in the eurozone, and can continue lightening the pockets of the other member states, which was the intention all  along. The real trouble being when the other members want their loans "forgiving" When the at the moment the rich north have restructured years of neglect and mal administration of the southern members. and beggared ourselves in the process will they remember and rush to our aid. Somehow, as my wife would put it "I hae my doots"

As a Portuguese citizen you make me sick. Your ridiculous superiority feelings and your us vs them/ we vs they view of the world is everything that is wrong with it and is exactly why there are so many people hating each other.

just another political experiment gone bad. just another reason why politicians should keep their noses out of anything that the people can't do better.

smiley face is back.

Badboy wrote:SOME ARE BLAMING THE BANKS LIKE GOLDMAN SACHS FOR COOKING THE BOOKS AND/OR  CREATIVE ACCOUNTANCY SO GREECE WOULDN'T BREACH THE 3% DEFICIT RULE OF EU.
SOME ARE SPECULATING THAT ITALY,PORTUGAL AND SPAIN MAY HAVE TO PAY MORE ON THEIR BONDS/DEBTS.

Good evening Badboy.

Straight to the heart of the problem. There are others apart from Greece who just did not fit the criteria. Unfortunately the ruling political classes resolutely ignored this in the interests of expanding the EU.

The average Greek citizen doesn't deserve what is happening to his/her country and more than we do as a result of the politicians "tinkering" with things they do not understand. Not that they will accept any blame now.

The wish to enter politics should automatically debar that person from doing so.

ITS APPEAR AN HUMANITARIAN AID PACKAGE IS BEING PREPARED.

I see Merkel and Hollande have their  heads together again prior to a Eurozone summit.  They decide what is going to happen and then tell the rest of them what they have to agree to.  Who put these two in charge is what I want to know?  It is not only the Eurozone they appear to be in charge of but all the EU!

When Cameron wanted to present his case for new terms for the UK, he was given 10 minutes at the end of a long dinner. some of the leaders were by then taking a toilet break. Then he was told that they would not have time to listen again until Christmas.  Basically he was treated like a pesky fly.  This is to a country that is one of the largest contributors. However it does not matter how much a country contributes it should still be listened to.  Each country has it's own concerns. Merkel and Hollande get their heads together and get support from their friends and no one stands a chance.

There is nothing democratic about the EU it is a dictatorship.  The way they have behaved in the Greek crisis is a shambles, totally shocking.  I have no faith in the whole caboodle, they will ruin us all.

fuzeta wrote:I see Merkel and Hollande have their  heads together again prior to a Eurozone summit.  They decide what is going to happen and then tell the rest of them what they have to agree to.  Who put these two in charge is what I want to know?  It is not only the Eurozone they appear to be in charge of but all the EU!

When Cameron wanted to present his case for new terms for the UK, he was given 10 minutes at the end of a long dinner. some of the leaders were by then taking a toilet break. Then he was told that they would not have time to listen again until Christmas.  Basically he was treated like a pesky fly.  This is to a country that is one of the largest contributors. However it does not matter how much a country contributes it should still be listened to.  Each country has it's own concerns. Merkel and Hollande get their heads together and get support from their friends and no one stands a chance.

There is nothing democratic about the EU it is a dictatorship.  The way they have behaved in the Greek crises is a shambles, totally shocking.  I have no faith in the whole caboodle, they will ruin us all.

absolutely spot on fuzeta

I keep reading about the Greek retirement age but can't find much real info. Does anyone know what the actual retirement age is?

ITS BEEN INCREASED TO 67,I THINK.
SOME ARE SAYING GREECE IS AN EXTREME EXAMPLE OF CAPALITISM,AVOIDING TAXES,NOT WANTINGG TO PAY DEBTS.
ALSO BEEN POINTED OUT THAT GERMANY NEVER PAID ITS DEBTS.

GREECE HAS MEET EUROZONE LEADERS WITH NO NEW PROPOSALS.
BRITAIN MIGHT FLY EUROS TO GREECE SO BRITISH TOURISTS DON'T RUN OUT OF EUROS.

GREECE HAS UNTIL SUNDAY TO DELIVER SERIOUS PROPOSALS,SUPPORT FOR ITS BANKS WILL END IF NO DEAL IS REACHED.
THE SUSPENSE IS MURDERING ME.
ON A SLIGHTLY SEPARATE NOTE,I SAW A PROGRAMME ABOUT COUNCILS BORROWING LOTS OF MONEY FROM THE BANKS,A GREECE STYLE CRISIS COULD DEVELOPE THERE.

As expected once again Greece has 'defaulted' so the title of this thread is clearly incorrect.Infact pretty much this whole thread has been about slagging off Greece for joining the Euro and scrounging off the rest of us with no intention of paying off any debts ! So whats the point of starting a thread saying they wont default and then saying they always intended to default.
Do you really think the Greek people want to cheat on the rest of us !
I have been to Greece many times and they are lovely hard working people just like most of us so stop slagging them off please.
This is nothing to do with a particular race of people it is about narcisistic power brokers.

The EU is as corrupt as Sepp Blatter and his cronies playing a game of subbuteo !

Lioned wrote:As expected once again Greece has 'defaulted' so the title of this thread is clearly incorrect.Infact pretty much this whole thread has been about slagging off Greece for joining the Euro and scrounging off the rest of us with no intention of paying off any debts ! So whats the point of starting a thread saying they wont default and then saying they always intended to default.
Do you really think the Greek people want to cheat on the rest of us !
I have been to Greece many times and they are lovely hard working people just like most of us so stop slagging them off please.
This is nothing to do with a particular race of people it is about narcisistic power brokers.

The EU is as corrupt as Sepp Blatter and his cronies playing a game of  subbuteo !

Lioned, you restore my faith in humanity.

katertaif wrote:

fuzeta wrote:I see Merkel and Hollande have their  heads together again prior to a Eurozone summit.  They decide what is going to happen and then tell the rest of them what they have to agree to.  Who put these two in charge is what I want to know?  It is not only the Eurozone they appear to be in charge of but all the EU!

When Cameron wanted to present his case for new terms for the UK, he was given 10 minutes at the end of a long dinner. some of the leaders were by then taking a toilet break. Then he was told that they would not have time to listen again until Christmas.  Basically he was treated like a pesky fly.  This is to a country that is one of the largest contributors. However it does not matter how much a country contributes it should still be listened to.  Each country has it's own concerns. Merkel and Hollande get their heads together and get support from their friends and no one stands a chance.

There is nothing democratic about the EU it is a dictatorship.  The way they have behaved in the Greek crises is a shambles, totally shocking.  I have no faith in the whole caboodle, they will ruin us all.

absolutely spot on fuzeta

Totally agree!

Claudia79 wrote:

Lioned wrote:As expected once again Greece has 'defaulted' so the title of this thread is clearly incorrect.Infact pretty much this whole thread has been about slagging off Greece for joining the Euro and scrounging off the rest of us with no intention of paying off any debts ! So whats the point of starting a thread saying they wont default and then saying they always intended to default.
Do you really think the Greek people want to cheat on the rest of us !
I have been to Greece many times and they are lovely hard working people just like most of us so stop slagging them off please.
This is nothing to do with a particular race of people it is about narcisistic power brokers.

The EU is as corrupt as Sepp Blatter and his cronies playing a game of  subbuteo !

Lioned, you restore my faith in humanity.

I agree Lioned.  My heart goes out to the hard working people of Greece.

Hello Pennylane, lovely to see you on the forum again. It really is a shocking state of affairs. The Greek people are in dire straits they are running out of medicine, supermarket shelves have been cleared. The banks have no money. They are a member of the EU for God's sake. Is this what happens to an EU member when it gets in dire straits? It does not give much hope to the rest of us should similar befall us.

Whatever mistakes previous Greek governments have made it cannot be changed. It is time to see the situation as it is now and act accordingly. Merkel and co seem to want to make them suffer and bleed even more. Greece cannot accept anymore severe austerity measures. They must be offered something that will give them a chance of economic growth. If not, it will just carry on the same, only worse. The last austerity measure pushed them back and not forward. They have to be given a chance to move forward.

I have always thought the Euro a disaster for many countries. It should never have been introduced, crazy idea. Hollande needs to be careful with his strutting because economically France is not doing so good either.

So what will Merkel and co do if Greece does not agree? Send humanitarian aid? because that is what it will come to. Or will she deny them even that? One thing I know for sure is that I will be voting to come out of this dictatorship called the EU.

fuzeta wrote:Hello Pennylane, lovely to see you on the forum again.  It really is a shocking state of affairs.  The Greek people are in dire straits they are running out of medicine, supermarket shelves have been cleared.  The banks have no money.  They are a member of the EU for God's sake.  Is this what happens to an EU member when it gets in dire straits?  It does not give much hope to the rest of us should similar befall us.

Whatever mistakes previous Greek governments have made it cannot be changed.  It is time to see the situation as it is now and act accordingly.  Merkel and co seem to want to make them suffer and bleed even more.  Greece cannot accept anymore severe austerity measures.  They must be offered something that will give them a chance of economic growth. If not, it will just carry on the same, only worse.   The last austerity measure pushed them back and not forward.  They have to be given a chance to move forward.

I have always thought the Euro a disaster for many countries. It should never have been introduced, crazy idea.  Hollande needs to be careful with his strutting because economically France is not doing so good either.

So what will Merkel and co do if Greece does not agree?  Send humanitarian aid?  because that is what it will come to. Or will she deny them even that?    One thing I know for sure is that I will be voting to come out of this dictatorship called the EU.

Hello fuzeta  

I am in complete agreement with you, and will also be voting to come out of the EU, when the opportunity finally avails itself.  The EU is a fiasco of epic proportions, and the situation in Greece is absolute proof of this.

Hello again Penny. It seems to me that since the EU got it's stranglehold on us all, every European country is up to it's neck in debt, Eurozone or otherwise. Yet we all seem frightened to break out of it. At least our governments do, It surely cannot be right, one day the whole thing will implode. The rest of the World seems to be growing and we are all going backwards.

I have just been reading and it seems Greece is going to take the medicine. It is either that or starve I suppose. Next thing will be that Merkel will want rid of Tsipras for daring to make a stand.

Nice to see you

Hi fuzeta, I too agree with you ,I just wonder if a lot of the debt will be overlooked ,as if it does fall by wayside ,it will I think cause problems for rest of them ?Will they need to overlook a lot of the debts?At last minute? joyce1938

There is no reason why Greece cannot sustain itself if it leaves the Euro.Infact the Euro has worked very much against it,as it has with other countries
Greece has one of the largest merchant Navy's in the World for shipping goods now mainly from Asia.Its tourist industry is well known and would improve substantially with the return of the Drachma.
They are best to get out of the Euro as would be Spain and Italy and France and Portugal.

ITS SEEMS THAT AN AGREEMENT HAS BEEN REACHED,I BELIEVE BY SWALLOWING AUSTERITY MEASURES.
ON MY TWITTER FEED ,THERE ARE SEVERAL PEOPLE SAYING SUPPORT GREECE VIA ITS TOURISM INDUSTRY.