jo yeates

Alpine Aster wrote:

FreddieFireHog wrote:What happens if she never arrived home at all? but the coat bag keys and mobile did?

The Pizza was over looked and left somewhere else perhaps in a car and the receipt stuffed in a pocket!

Which ever way you look at it. She let someone in she knew, as there was no sign of a break in, or someone with access to keys let themselves in knowing there was no one at home left her belongings and then simply left

Nits

Hi Nits.

That is very possible, that someone else put the item's in the Flat, I do believe the receipt for the Pizza was found in the Flat, but not the Pizza, maybe she shared it with someone who lives close,the Post-Mortem will reveal if Joanna did eat the Pizza.
Nobody knows when Joanna died only that she was alive by the Tesco CCTV at that time stated on the recording.

I doubt that Joanna would be walking around a Country lane in the dark in this Weather at Night, and had an accident, that lead to her demise.

I expect that the snowfall will hold a clue as to when Joanna was placed there, as she was covered in snow, she could have been there for a while and missed by the search Helicopter's because she was hidden by the snow.
The Post-Mortem will reveal some important clues.

Sorry I missed this

It snowed on Saturday 18th December In Bristol

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-12025793

Marky wrote:

Loopdaloop wrote:To become a cab driver (apart from the london kind) you don't need a CRB, you don't need any checks and it seems to be a profession where middle aged men who get marginalised from other jobs (due to crime or accusations of crime) seem to take.

that's one hell of a statement.

this girl lived in clifton, one of the thirty-five council wards in the city of bristol which serves as the unitary authority. all taxi or private hire drivers would have to be licenced by bristol city council using the following procedures...

http://www.bristol.gov.uk/redirect/?oid=Article-id-35267087

...which strangely enough include a CRB.

this i suspect is the standard for the UK.

One of my friends is a Prison Guard and its one of the job areas that they proactively help support ex-crim's into getting into as you can be your own boss and work your own hours. Again, Generally, one of the issues that people with criminal backgrounds have is the inability to conform to the general routine of society e.g. your 9-5 so it is helpful for them to go into jobs with what others would consider more anti-social hours. Such as your lorry driving, cab driving etc etc. I have also personally noticed that the sorts of people who get struck off from being able to work with vulnerable adults or children also seem to go into working as cabbies for some reason.

Also theres a lot of 'private hire' where you don't have to get licensed / or people don't bother.

A BBC news report about it.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8446122.stm
Criminals with convictions for offences such as indecent assault and drug dealing are knowingly being licensed to operate as taxi drivers, an investigation by the BBC programme Inside Out West Midlands has revealed.
Freedom of Information requests to councils and police authorities across the West Midlands region discovered that over the past three years 209 people with previous convictions have been given a licence, despite criminal records checks being carried out.
In Wolverhampton, a man who between 1985 and 2005 had carried out more than 30 offences was, in 2006, deemed suitable to become a taxi driver.

There are no official rules about licensing taxi drivers. Instead, councils tend to follow various guidelines, one of which is issued by the Department of Transport

However; Don't get me wrong i'm not saying all taxi drivers are this that or the other but I was merely suggesting the link. Also RE: someone saying she was fit enough to walk that distance. It is very cold and icey about at the moment and I know a lot of women who are fit and healthy enough to walk any distance but still catch cabs for convenience in this cold even short distances!

With regard to 'nits' saying that suspecting the boyfriend is no different from suspecting the Mccans I'd argue that it is completely different! The boyfriend hasn't hired PR for a start.... (and hasnt attempted the manipulation of the facts, media and public [yet!]) I don't believe innocent people need to manipulate public opinion; getting a solicitor for court is one thing if someone is trying to set you up but going on a PR war is weird. Hence the boyfriend hasn't done this yet so perhaps it could be this mystery killer..... (? ?)

Loopdaloop wrote:

Marky wrote:

Loopdaloop wrote:To become a cab driver (apart from the london kind) you don't need a CRB, you don't need any checks and it seems to be a profession where middle aged men who get marginalised from other jobs (due to crime or accusations of crime) seem to take.

that's one hell of a statement.

this girl lived in clifton, one of the thirty-five council wards in the city of bristol which serves as the unitary authority. all taxi or private hire drivers would have to be licenced by bristol city council using the following procedures...

http://www.bristol.gov.uk/redirect/?oid=Article-id-35267087

...which strangely enough include a CRB.

this i suspect is the standard for the UK.

One of my friends is a Prison Guard and its one of the job areas that they proactively help support ex-crim's into getting into as you can be your own boss and work your own hours. Again, Generally, one of the issues that people with criminal backgrounds have is the inability to conform to the general routine of society e.g. your 9-5 so it is helpful for them to go into jobs with what others would consider more anti-social hours. Such as your lorry driving, cab driving etc etc. I have also personally noticed that the sorts of people who get struck off from being able to work with vulnerable adults or children also seem to go into working as cabbies for some reason.

Also theres a lot of 'private hire' where you don't have to get licensed / or people don't bother.

A BBC news report about it.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8446122.stm
Criminals with convictions for offences such as indecent assault and drug dealing are knowingly being licensed to operate as taxi drivers, an investigation by the BBC programme Inside Out West Midlands has revealed.
Freedom of Information requests to councils and police authorities across the West Midlands region discovered that over the past three years 209 people with previous convictions have been given a licence, despite criminal records checks being carried out.
In Wolverhampton, a man who between 1985 and 2005 had carried out more than 30 offences was, in 2006, deemed suitable to become a taxi driver.

There are no official rules about licensing taxi drivers. Instead, councils tend to follow various guidelines, one of which is issued by the Department of Transport

However; Don't get me wrong i'm not saying all taxi drivers are this that or the other but I was merely suggesting the link. Also RE: someone saying she was fit enough to walk that distance. It is very cold and icey about at the moment and I know a lot of women who are fit and healthy enough to walk any distance but still catch cabs for convenience in this cold even short distances!

With regard to 'nits' saying that suspecting the boyfriend is no different from suspecting the Mccans I'd argue that it is completely different! The boyfriend hasn't hired PR for a start.... (and hasnt attempted the manipulation of the facts, media and public [yet!]) I don't believe innocent people need to manipulate public opinion; getting a solicitor for court is one thing if someone is trying to set you up but going on a PR war is weird. Hence the boyfriend hasn't done this yet so perhaps it could be this mystery killer..... (? ?)

nope. now if your talking about unlicensed mini cabs in big cities you should have said so but you didn't. you made a generalisation and an incorrect one simply to suit your theory. you mentioned a taxi rank outside the tescos express store and implied an adult female would bare her soul to an unknown individual simply because in your words ' they like to chat'. you can't have it both ways. you are wrong and you should admit so. if you want to fantasise go somewhere else. the only thing that gives your theory/opinion any credibility is that an educated female has got into an unlicensed vehicle and spilt her guts to someone she doesn't know and i'm sorry pal, that don't wash.

but hey, you got a rep point.

Everybody calm down! Without the key elements just in the police possession, any theory is just that: a theory. Probably more important than anything else, is what her body can reveal and so far (that I've read) nothing is being said about it - the right move. So, let's wait for more developments. It's no doubt, a very sad case.

May she rest in peace.

Sky News Report


The family and boyfriend of Joanna Yeates have visited the spot where her body was found on Christmas Day.
Miss Yeates' family has now formally identified the 25-year-old's body. Police are treating her death as suspicious.

Her parents David and Theresa laid flowers in Longwood Lane, close to Bristol and Clifton Golf Club.

Her boyfriend Greg Reardon also left a bouquet at the roadside.

They hope to hear the results of a post-mortem examination tomorrow.

A police spokesman said: "The difficult conditions in which she was found, particularly the frozen condition of her body, means that the post-mortem has still not been concluded, and police are not going to be in a position to confirm the cause of her death until tomorrow at the earliest."

The landscape architect's body was found by a couple walking their dogs on Christmas morning.

Officers will look at CCTV footage from Clifton suspension bridge in Bristol, on the main route from Miss Yeates' house to where she was found on Christmas Day, a distance of about three miles.


Well it would appear that the boyfriend is not suspected, at least by the Parents.

Marky wrote:

nope. now if your talking about unlicensed mini cabs in big cities you should have said so but you didn't. you made a generalisation and an incorrect one simply to suit your theory. you mentioned a taxi rank outside the tescos express store and implied an adult female would bare her soul to an unknown individual simply because in your words ' they like to chat'. you can't have it both ways. you are wrong and you should admit so. if you want to fantasise go somewhere else. the only thing that gives your theory/opinion any credibility is that an educated female has got into an unlicensed vehicle and spilt her guts to someone she doesn't know and i'm sorry pal, that don't wash.

but hey, you got a rep point.

I stand firm when I say both licensed AND unlicensed cab driver positions can attract a certain type of male of a certain background and the prison service encourages it and councils overlook convictions. As well as that report by the BBC I linked earlier which showed that there are no official rules about licensing taxi drivers another prime example was John Worboys (and he was licensed)- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Worboys or the un-named man diagnosed with paranoid schizophrenia who when ill murdered his wife and has a conviction for assualt however for purposes of rehab is studying to take the knowledge. http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/UK-News/Convicted-Killer-Studying-To-Be-London-Black-Cab-Driver-Man-Allowed-To-Take-The-Knowledge/Article/200909115373440

Yes it is generalisation; but there is a lot of evidence to support it! Education levels of a person has no bearing on whether someone would get into a licensed or unlicensed cab, If something looks the part and is in a situation which seems familiar people are likely to go for it without questioning. People respect authority of situation or uniform (even if that uniform is a metal car with a sticker on the side or a light on the top) more often than not unquestionably, unless they have strong reason to think otherwise. Its something subconscious we all do, The BBC show the Real Hustle makes use of this fact day in and day out when they show how to scam people.

However, I didn't 'imply an adult female would bare their soul', what I did say is that we all know taxi drivers like to have some chit chat.
and tongues are looser after you've had a few drinks, In the video of her scanning the pizza she sure took a while....

Where to love?
Where ya been this evening?
Not doing much tonight?
Pizza for one is it?

Its basic chitchat; no more or less than you would hear at the checkout of a supermarket however there is someone, somewhere who knew she would be on her own and took advantage of the situation.


How I got onto the subject was through speculating about the links between this case and the other unsolved cases which police have been put forward and the taxi rank near the tescos and people getting taxi's after nightclubs is the main casual link I could think of!
Which is why I was interested in other peoples ideas about why these cases may have been linked! or why the police may think they were linked (apart from the fact of them being unexplained disappearances)

The problem is, is that nobody knows whether Jo got a taxi cab that night or not so it's all pointless speculation in a way. However, without wishing to generalise, it is a fact that being a cab driver does allow men to have contact with vulnerable women on their own. Sadly, this could be a motive for certain predatory men.

However, from the few facts we know, it seems that Jo arrived home safely as her purse, phone and keys were left at the flat. As there was no sign of a break-in, either Jo unwittingly let the person in by not taking precautions such as using the chain when somebody rang on the bell, or someone was let into the flat because they weren't considered to be a danger. The missing pizza is very odd.

With regard to 'nits' saying that suspecting the boyfriend is no different from suspecting the Mccans I'd argue that it is completely different! The boyfriend hasn't hired PR for a start.... (and hasnt attempted the manipulation of the facts, media and public [yet!]) I don't believe innocent people need to manipulate public opinion; getting a solicitor for court is one thing if someone is trying to set you up but going on a PR war is weird. Hence the boyfriend hasn't done this yet so perhaps it could be this mystery killer..... (? ?)

Apologies I was trying to make a point in general. It was in bad taste and poorly made.

Nits

Loopdaloop wrote:

Marky wrote:

nope. now if your talking about unlicensed mini cabs in big cities you should have said so but you didn't. you made a generalisation and an incorrect one simply to suit your theory. you mentioned a taxi rank outside the tescos express store and implied an adult female would bare her soul to an unknown individual simply because in your words ' they like to chat'. you can't have it both ways. you are wrong and you should admit so. if you want to fantasise go somewhere else. the only thing that gives your theory/opinion any credibility is that an educated female has got into an unlicensed vehicle and spilt her guts to someone she doesn't know and i'm sorry pal, that don't wash.

but hey, you got a rep point.

I stand firm when I say both licensed AND unlicensed cab driver positions can attract a certain type of male of a certain background and the prison service encourages it and councils overlook convictions. As well as that report by the BBC I linked earlier which showed that there are no official rules about licensing taxi drivers another prime example was John Worboys (and he was licensed)- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Worboys or the un-named man diagnosed with paranoid schizophrenia who when ill murdered his wife and has a conviction for assualt however for purposes of rehab is studying to take the knowledge. http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/UK-News/Convicted-Killer-Studying-To-Be-London-Black-Cab-Driver-Man-Allowed-To-Take-The-Knowledge/Article/200909115373440

Yes it is generalisation; but there is a lot of evidence to support it! Education levels of a person has no bearing on whether someone would get into a licensed or unlicensed cab, If something looks the part and is in a situation which seems familiar people are likely to go for it without questioning. People respect authority of situation or uniform (even if that uniform is a metal car with a sticker on the side or a light on the top) more often than not unquestionably, unless they have strong reason to think otherwise. Its something subconscious we all do, The BBC show the Real Hustle makes use of this fact day in and day out when they show how to scam people.

However, I didn't 'imply an adult female would bare their soul', what I did say is that we all know taxi drivers like to have some chit chat.
and tongues are looser after you've had a few drinks, In the video of her scanning the pizza she sure took a while....

Where to love?
Where ya been this evening?
Not doing much tonight?
Pizza for one is it?

Its basic chitchat; no more or less than you would hear at the checkout of a supermarket however there is someone, somewhere who knew she would be on her own and took advantage of the situation.


How I got onto the subject was through speculating about the links between this case and the other unsolved cases which police have been put forward and the taxi rank near the tescos and people getting taxi's after nightclubs is the main casual link I could think of!
Which is why I was interested in other peoples ideas about why these cases may have been linked! or why the police may think they were linked (apart from the fact of them being unexplained disappearances)

loopdaloop, from some of the things that I've heard, you are right in what you say.

On a slightly different note, this recent thread

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=1412389

from digital spy made me chortle.

Wallflower wrote:

Loopdaloop wrote:

Marky wrote:

nope. now if your talking about unlicensed mini cabs in big cities you should have said so but you didn't. you made a generalisation and an incorrect one simply to suit your theory. you mentioned a taxi rank outside the tescos express store and implied an adult female would bare her soul to an unknown individual simply because in your words ' they like to chat'. you can't have it both ways. you are wrong and you should admit so. if you want to fantasise go somewhere else. the only thing that gives your theory/opinion any credibility is that an educated female has got into an unlicensed vehicle and spilt her guts to someone she doesn't know and i'm sorry pal, that don't wash.

but hey, you got a rep point.

I stand firm when I say both licensed AND unlicensed cab driver positions can attract a certain type of male of a certain background and the prison service encourages it and councils overlook convictions. As well as that report by the BBC I linked earlier which showed that there are no official rules about licensing taxi drivers another prime example was John Worboys (and he was licensed)- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Worboys or the un-named man diagnosed with paranoid schizophrenia who when ill murdered his wife and has a conviction for assualt however for purposes of rehab is studying to take the knowledge. http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/UK-News/Convicted-Killer-Studying-To-Be-London-Black-Cab-Driver-Man-Allowed-To-Take-The-Knowledge/Article/200909115373440

Yes it is generalisation; but there is a lot of evidence to support it! Education levels of a person has no bearing on whether someone would get into a licensed or unlicensed cab, If something looks the part and is in a situation which seems familiar people are likely to go for it without questioning. People respect authority of situation or uniform (even if that uniform is a metal car with a sticker on the side or a light on the top) more often than not unquestionably, unless they have strong reason to think otherwise. Its something subconscious we all do, The BBC show the Real Hustle makes use of this fact day in and day out when they show how to scam people.

However, I didn't 'imply an adult female would bare their soul', what I did say is that we all know taxi drivers like to have some chit chat.
and tongues are looser after you've had a few drinks, In the video of her scanning the pizza she sure took a while....

Where to love?
Where ya been this evening?
Not doing much tonight?
Pizza for one is it?

Its basic chitchat; no more or less than you would hear at the checkout of a supermarket however there is someone, somewhere who knew she would be on her own and took advantage of the situation.


How I got onto the subject was through speculating about the links between this case and the other unsolved cases which police have been put forward and the taxi rank near the tescos and people getting taxi's after nightclubs is the main casual link I could think of!
Which is why I was interested in other peoples ideas about why these cases may have been linked! or why the police may think they were linked (apart from the fact of them being unexplained disappearances)

loopdaloop, from some of the things that I've heard, you are right in what you say.

On a slightly different note, this recent thread

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=1412389

from digital spy made me chortle.

From what I can see, hackney and private hire cab drivers are not exempt from the Rahabilitation of Offenders Act ( http://www.justice.gov.uk/guidance/rehabilitation-of-offenders-act.htm ):



http://www.civilandcorporate.co.uk/legislation-detail-rehab.html

This could turn out to be a work mate.

speculation that she may have died of hypothermia as there were no obvious injuries.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2010/12/28/police-fear-joanna-yeates-may-have-frozen-to-death-after-being-dumped-alive-at-roadside-115875-22810799/

Lioned wrote:This could turn out to be a work mate.

or someone she could have come into either direct or indirect contact with during the course of her work particularly if she did site visits.

I suggested this early on, that she met some guy she knew, possibly in Waitrose, he waited at the entrance to Tesco while she bought the Pizza,
they went back to his place to eat it, he drove her home , was invited in for a nightcap and maybe got fresh, she resisted and a fatal accident happened.
He took Jo"s body 3 miles away to hide it, but in his haste didn"t cover it properly so it was found. Since the initial theory was that Jo had been kidnapped
I wonder if the Flat was fingerprinted thoroughly at the start.

Panda wrote:
I suggested this early on, that she met some guy she knew, possibly in Waitrose, he waited at the entrance to Tesco while she bought the Pizza, they went back to his place to eat it, he drove her home, was invited in for a nightcap and maybe got fresh, she resisted and a fatal accident happened. He took Jo"s body 3 miles away to hide it, but in his haste didn"t cover it properly so it was found. Since the initial theory was that Jo had been kidnapped
I wonder if the Flat was fingerprinted thoroughly at the start.

seems she visited a third shop and bought a bottle of cider.

Marky wrote:

Panda wrote:
I suggested this early on, that she met some guy she knew, possibly in Waitrose, he waited at the entrance to Tesco while she bought the Pizza, they went back to his place to eat it, he drove her home, was invited in for a nightcap and maybe got fresh, she resisted and a fatal accident happened. He took Jo"s body 3 miles away to hide it, but in his haste didn"t cover it properly so it was found. Since the initial theory was that Jo had been kidnapped
I wonder if the Flat was fingerprinted thoroughly at the start.

seems she visited a third shop and bought a bottle of cider.

Just call me Sherlock Marky.

Panda wrote:

Marky wrote:

Panda wrote:
I suggested this early on, that she met some guy she knew, possibly in Waitrose, he waited at the entrance to Tesco while she bought the Pizza, they went back to his place to eat it, he drove her home, was invited in for a nightcap and maybe got fresh, she resisted and a fatal accident happened. He took Jo"s body 3 miles away to hide it, but in his haste didn"t cover it properly so it was found. Since the initial theory was that Jo had been kidnapped
I wonder if the Flat was fingerprinted thoroughly at the start.

seems she visited a third shop and bought a bottle of cider.

Just call me Sherlock Marky.

sherlock marky? must admit it's got a ring to it.

Wonder if we find out today how she died?

fred wrote:Wonder if we find out today how she died?

guess it depends how deep frozen she was. either later today or tomorrow. seems the police have distanced themselves from the theory she died of hypothermia. strange though no obvious injuries.

Marky wrote:

fred wrote:Wonder if we find out today how she died?

guess it depends how deep frozen she was. either later today or tomorrow. seems the police have distanced themselves from the theory she died of hypothermia. strange though no obvious injuries.

Just been tweeted:

@mwilliamsthomas

Press Conference at midday- where police will give update & hopefully Post-mortem results

carmen wrote:

Marky wrote:

fred wrote:Wonder if we find out today how she died?

guess it depends how deep frozen she was. either later today or tomorrow. seems the police have distanced themselves from the theory she died of hypothermia. strange though no obvious injuries.

Just been tweeted:

@mwilliamsthomas

Press Conference at midday- where police will give update & hopefully Post-mortem results

ok, ta.

http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/s/1403798_nathan_tomlinson_tenth_day_of_search_for_man_who_went_missing_after_christmas_party

O/T But this is a young man who has been missing since before Christmas

hmmm, strangled and they say she lay on that verge for several days in spite of locals saying otherwise.

Sky News

Police have confirmed Joanna Yeates, whose snow-covered body was found by dog walkers on Christmas Day, died after being strangled.

A murder investigation is now underway after the landscape architect's body was earlier identified by her parents David, 63, and Theresa, 58, who made an emotional visit to the site where she was discovered.

Speaking at a press conference at midday, Detective Chief Inspector Phil Jones, who is leading the murder probe, said a post-mortem examination showed Miss Yeates died from "compression to the neck - in other words strangulation".

He offered "heartfelt condolences" to Miss Yeates' family and urged anyone with information to contact police.

Miss Yeates' boyfriend Gregory Reardon was a witness in the investigation, he said, and he confirmed Miss Yeates was fully clothed when she was found.

The 25-year-old's snow-covered body was found by dog walkers in a quiet lane just three miles from her home in Clifton, Bristol, on Christmas morning.

But the frozen condition of her corpse meant pathologists could not immediately examine it - leaving detectives and family members waiting to find out the cause of her death.

Interesting how little information has been given out-"compression to the neck, I.e. Strangulation".

AnnaEsse wrote:Sky News

Police have confirmed Joanna Yeates, whose snow-covered body was found by dog walkers on Christmas Day, died after being strangled.

A murder investigation is now underway after the landscape architect's body was earlier identified by her parents David, 63, and Theresa, 58, who made an emotional visit to the site where she was discovered.

Speaking at a press conference at midday, Detective Chief Inspector Phil Jones, who is leading the murder probe, said a post-mortem examination showed Miss Yeates died from "compression to the neck - in other words strangulation".

He offered "heartfelt condolences" to Miss Yeates' family and urged anyone with information to contact police.

Miss Yeates' boyfriend Gregory Reardon was a witness in the investigation, he said, and he confirmed Miss Yeates was fully clothed when she was found.

The 25-year-old's snow-covered body was found by dog walkers in a quiet lane just three miles from her home in Clifton, Bristol, on Christmas morning.

But the frozen condition of her corpse meant pathologists could not immediately examine it - leaving detectives and family members waiting to find out the cause of her death.