'Maddie ' found in Greece

It's the "sudden" tips that I find curious.

me too interested. I feel for the child, and possibly the people she calls mum and dad. she hasn't been trafficked and as the hospital say, she is healthy so what happens to her if no one can find her real parents. that's my question

I agree that this situation needs sorting out, as does the new beautiful little fair haired girl found to be with gypsies in Ireland, but I do find it slightly creepy and almost a bit racist. Unpleasant darkish-skinned Roma useless people have care of a precious... etc etc... Pity the small balck boy who goes missing. Who would notice him in the wrong place?

Not Born Yesterday wrote:How they can think the girl in Greece could be Lisa Irwin I don't know! She would be 3 in November whereas the other child is thought to be about 6.

When Lisa Irwin was reported "missing", a cadaver dog alerted to the scent of a dead body on the floor near her mother's bed.

Oh dear. I didn't know that. About the dog, I mean.

comperedna wrote:Oh dear. I didn't know that. About the dog, I mean.

The cadaver dog's "alert" is contained in the court documents.

You won't be surprised to hear that this was claimed to be unreliable!
 
http://www.examiner.com/article/attorney-cadaver-dog-alert-baby-lisa-irwin-s-home-may-be-unreliable

Not Born Yesterday wrote:You won't be surprised to hear that this was claimed to be unreliable!
 
http://www.examiner.com/article/attorney-cadaver-dog-alert-baby-lisa-irwin-s-home-may-be-unreliable

The unreliable claim comes from the attorney representing the parents.

I can't find the article that I read earlier, but it was interesting in that it said a dentist had assessed Maria's age at around 6 or 7 according to her teeth.

ETA: This article states that Maria is believed to be around 5 or 6. Baby Lisa Irwin would be not quite 3, so no chance of Maria being her.

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2013/10/22/greek-prosecutor-orders-birth-certificate-investigation-in-mystery-girl-maria/

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/greece-girl-maria-gypsy-couple-2477760

5 or 6 years old according to this report about the dental examination.

Regarding Lisa Irwin, Pat Brown has tweeted: "Yep, that makes sense. Someone stole Baby Lisa from Missouri, bought a ticket to Europe, and sold her to gypsies for $100."

interested wrote:Regarding Lisa Irwin, Pat Brown has tweeted: "Yep, that makes sense.  Someone stole Baby Lisa from Missouri, bought a ticket to Europe, and sold her to gypsies for $100."

It's not Madeline if she's 6 or 7 or 4, either. No DNA required for that although I hope the Fund will not query that expenditure if they are willing to take hope from this child being found it is surely worth the price of the test.

Gypsies if they are into buying kids for profit - making them beg, dance, etc - might invest $100 in a child whose parents sadly don't want or can't care for her - but if it's profit they are looking for you would think the rewards, even if not $1M for MM - would be more interesting as a money generating scheme. In the US Child Finders and the rewards from various organizations named for kids or adults who go missing - Carrington Foundation - are high, $100,000 or in that range - you would have to beg a lot of coins for that kind of money.

I hope this child is not abused nor neglected and that she finds her way home safely and not into a worse situation.

there was a substantial sum of money available to the person(s) providing information leading to the safe return of Madeleine McCann. I think at the time it totalled in the region of £2.5 million from various sources. this is one of the reasons why I believe Maddie is no longer with us. To my knowledge it has never been published that anyone came forward with any information about Madeleine s disappearance leading to her safe return. why is that?

I just can't see gypsies going to all the bother of abducting children from holiday destinations from well off families, breaking into bedrooms, hiding about inside apartments, climbing through windows, walking through streets past Irish families coming from a bars, because for what? Begging purposes indeed. No way would they go to that trouble when there are hard up and almost homeless Eastern European families desperate for even a small amount of money and with children they can't look after, blonde into the bargain, who are willing, upsetting as it must be, to hand over their children.

tanszi wrote:there was a substantial sum of money available to the person(s) providing information leading to the safe return of Madeleine McCann.  I think at the time it totalled in the region of £2.5 million from various sources.    this is one of the reasons why I believe Maddie is no longer with us.  To my knowledge it has never been published that anyone came forward with any information about Madeleine s disappearance leading to her safe return.  why is that?

It's nearly impossible that as much as MM was publicized that if she survived the initial ordeal she would have been kept alive by her captors for someone to notice and call police. There are people who will kill you for much less money. I have always thought that MM died that night, because that is what usually happens with parents who accidentally or purposely kill their children and claim they were abducted and with tiny children abducted by pedophiles, and so either way her chances are very, very slim, I think Pat Brown put it at 5% and I think given that and the fact she's never been seen nor heard from by anyone reliable since May 7th would corroborate that.

Not sure why they wouldn't publicize the reward. They certainly promoted the Fund - if the reward were for info leading to the arrest of her killer and they didn't publicize it, then I would be cynical and think that they might not want people to come forward and solve this if they could still get benefactors and donations for the "search" - but why would they benefit from not publicizing the Fund for info leading to her safe return? If they know she is not with us, then there can be no such information.

LJC wrote:I just can't see gypsies going to all the bother of abducting children from holiday destinations from well off families, breaking into bedrooms, hiding about inside apartments, climbing through windows, walking through streets past Irish families coming from a bars, because for what?  Begging purposes indeed.  No way would they go to that trouble when there are hard up and almost homeless Eastern European families desperate for even a small amount of money and with children they can't look after, blonde into the bargain, who are willing, upsetting as it must be, to hand over their children.

I think a resort would be a great place to go to steal goods - because people who go to resorts are at least a little bit well off, and they are probably drinking if it's one of those all inclusive ones, and laid back on holiday not being as careful as they could because what can possibly go wrong here in sleepy PDL, etc.

I should think you could easily get away with a laptop, digital camera, ipad, cash, jewelry... Not children. But it must resonate for a number of people, this idea of gypsies taking children, because I can remember my grandmother using that to make us come in and go to bed, or the gypsies will steal you. We knew it was a pretend threat and kind of a joke but still, there it is. My daughter had a book about Madeleine and the Gypsies, although I think in that case she ran away to them from her old house in Paris all covered with vines - rather than them stealing her. Still it seems to fit this fairy tale concept in the collective unconscious. More likely you are right, a poor family would give up the child. They do that in other countries although I thought child trafficking was of somewhat older girls.

interested wrote:
Do the police routinely check gypsy camps for children who look like they do not "belong" there?  I find the timing of these two (Greece and now Ireland) discoveries, coming as they do on the heels of the Crimewatch "show" which furthered the "abduction" myth, more than a little curious.  I can't remember any other such cases getting the world wide attention these current two are getting.  Now, if I was a suspicious person, I might think there is a connection along the lines of "see, the gypsies could have dunnit".

I can't speak for the Irish police and their gypsy camps.

However, the Greek police are generally afraid of the gypsy camps and rarely go in.

The one here in Rhodes is full of guns ( they often shoot at each other ), toxic fumes from burning garbage and power cables ( which are stolen, insulation removed and then sold as copper scrap ) and a whole host of other problems. It's been raided twice this year and the found a dozen stolen cars being driven, two more cars and a couple safes in the sea ( the camp is in an unused port ). ATM's located in outside are removed from their mounts using stolen recovery vehicles which are driven into the camp, often chased by police who will not enter ( the banks have either withdrawn the ATM's from service or erected concrete buildings around them ).

The gypsies will not leave the place despite having their illegally connected water supply cut off last month.

Here are electrical cables being burned at the camp:



Are there any blond girls in there? I don't think so because they would stand out as beggars on a relatively small island. Is Madeleine McCann in there? Not a chance - she died in room 5a of the Ocean Club in Praia de Luz more than 6 years ago.

They found the parents of the little Greek angel. And they are Bulgarian and they are may be not "innocent":

http://greece.greekreporter.com/2013/10/24/little-blond-girl-marias-biological-parents-found-in-bulgaria/http://greece.greekreporter.com/2013/10/24/little-blond-girl-marias-biological-parents-found-in-bulgaria/

frencheuropean wrote:They found the parents of the little Greek angel. And they are Bulgarian and they are may be not "innocent":

http://greece.greekreporter.com/2013/10/24/little-blond-girl-marias-biological-parents-found-in-bulgaria/http://greece.greekreporter.com/2013/10/24/little-blond-girl-marias-biological-parents-found-in-bulgaria/

And the Roma family not guilty, then. I mean of kidnapping. So all three Roma cases with blond kids were nothing to do with them kidnapping kids.

I saw someone claiming that blond haired children in Roma families even if they are natural born, are evidence that the Roma kidnapped their ANCESTOR, generations ago. So you see it is still their fault for kidnapping blond people.

widowan wrote:

frencheuropean wrote:They found the parents of the little Greek angel. And they are Bulgarian and they are may be not "innocent":

http://greece.greekreporter.com/2013/10/24/little-blond-girl-marias-biological-parents-found-in-bulgaria/http://greece.greekreporter.com/2013/10/24/little-blond-girl-marias-biological-parents-found-in-bulgaria/

And the Roma family not guilty, then. I mean of kidnapping. So all three Roma cases with blond kids were nothing to do with them kidnapping kids.

I saw someone claiming that blond haired children in Roma families even if they are natural born, are evidence that the Roma kidnapped their ANCESTOR, generations ago. So you see it is still their fault for kidnapping blond people.

See! We really do have to warn children about those gypsies coming to get them! Eeeeek!  

It is not impossible for dark people to have blonde kids.

For a start they could have had ivf in which case even the dna wouldn't match.

A mixed race couple could have twins,one black and one white !

Child could be from a previous marriage.

Are they going to check all little blonde girls that dont match their parents or just the Gypsy ones as that would be racist and take us back to Nazi cleansing !

Lioned wrote:It is not impossible for dark people to have blonde kids.

For a start they could have had ivf in which case even the dna wouldn't match.

A mixed race couple could have twins,one black and one white !

Child could be from a previous marriage.

Are they going to check all little blonde girls that dont match their parents or just the Gypsy ones as that would be racist and take us back to Nazi cleansing !

Or, even more obviously, the mother could have a child by a blond man she is no longer with, or her mother could have done, or her spouse could have that in his background.

I think most people are safe but little blond "angels" clearly don't belong with nasty dark people, I think is the message and what volumes that speaks about those who believe it.

absolutely widowan. hasn't the swarthy abductor, lawless villages and gipsies appeared in the context of this missing child. all because two people allegedly didnt provide adequate care and protection for their 3 children under 4 years of age by leaving them in an unlocked apartment whilst they went on the lash with friends. who would have thought their behaviour would have such far reaching implications, or is this what G meant by the wider agenda.

What is really making me cross is this - a little girl and boy in Ireland are taken away by police from their family for looking different. There were no reports of the children being neglected, ill cared for, abused, nothing. They did not even live in a camp, but were settled and living in houses. They simply looked different in a Roma family. On the other hand we have two "professional" people who left three children alone, in the dark, in a foreign country, night after night to go and enjoy themselves. They returned home with just two children, and yet nothing was done.

Figure that one out and please explain to me why this can happen.

tanszi wrote:absolutely widowan.  hasn't the swarthy abductor, lawless villages and gipsies appeared in the context of this missing child.  all because two people allegedly didnt provide adequate care and protection for their 3 children under 4 years of age by leaving them in an unlocked apartment whilst they went on the lash with friends.  who would have thought their behaviour would have such far reaching implications, or is this what G meant by the wider agenda.

I don't know what he meant, he is a mystery to me. What wider agenda? To help all missing children everywhere? no, not so much, they still intend to keep every cent for their own purposes which now do not even include searching for their own child, if it ever did. To receive wide press to fund the Fund? maybe.

So far, the PJ, PDL, Portugal, Amaral, gypsies, and a number of people who had nothing to do with anything apart from living near by and offering to help (Murat) have all been fed to the lions in order to keep the tabloid readership happily ensconced in their racist or xenophobic views that anything blond is worth more than anything that isn't, anyone rich has greater expectation of and is more deserving of help; that despite the evidence to the contrary people who leave their children unattended are models of responsible parenting; that doctors know better than resort workers about the advisability of leaving the kids alone, that Funds can and should be spent on the legal assistance of parents to protect them from their action/inaction, rather than used in finding the child which was supposed to be the reason it was set up.