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quickfingers wrote:The search is being carried out efficiently.   All of those people (and dogs) are not involved in any cover up and are searching to the best of their ability.      The only thing that could be controlled is the area they are searching.   They are doing everything right and let's hope they find what they are looking for.

  

quickfingers wrote:The search is being carried out efficiently.   All of those people (and dogs) are not involved in any cover up and are searching to the best of their ability.      The only thing that could be controlled is the area they are searching.   They are doing everything right and let's hope they find what they are looking for.

Hi quickfingers

This search is not being done right, if it was, as I have said previously, tents would be erected over the spots that were being searched, there would be a news black out and any journalists hanging around, would be removed.

If Redwood really wanted to find out what happened to Madeleine, he would have got together with the PJ, and requested the McCanns were taken in for questioning. They are the root cause of Madeleine's disappearance and the fact they have done everything in their power to save their own skins, including, lying and hindering the case, shows to me that they have played a part in Madeleine's disappearance, that would have ensured they received a hefty prison sentence.

Even if my beliefs are wrong, first and foremost, the McCanns should have been taken in for questioning, if only to eliminate them from the investigation. Redwood knows this and he was bang out of order, making a public statement, saying the McCanns along with their mates, were not persons of interest to him.

He has mouthed off to the media, about dead paedophiles, burglars and cleaners, being persons of interest to him. Why are these people persons of interest to Redwood, when the McCanns are not?

pennylane wrote:Not for one second do I believe Jane Tanner spilled the beans.  This Operation Grange dig is purely for show, and a desperate attempt for them to appear kosher, having failed abysmally in their objective to gain access and control of the Portuguese investigation (imo).  

Jog on Kate and Gerry, and take your dodgy team of deaf, dumb, and blind detectives at Operation Grange with you! 

Hello Penny I am with you. I don't suppose the people with the dogs and equipment plus the lower ranks of the British police force know this is going to be a whitewash. They are just doing the jobs they have been asked to do. That's all they know.

Deaf, dumb and blind detectives is spot on. See no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil. Not about the Mc'Canns anyway.

We may need to disagree but I believe the search is being carried out properly. They have cleared areas, used the ground penetrating radar and then the dogs. When they have signalled an area they have put up a tent and carried out digging and forensics inside the tent. Journalists are being kept outside the perimeter of the search zone but they have long lenses. Portugal is a free country and people can stand on the street and take photos. They asked the media for restraint and that is about all they can do.

I am not saying there is no cover up and that anything will come out of these searches but the people doing them are professionals and doing them properly. It is nice to see the Portuguese and British working together on this.

As I have said before I am not sure if we will get any result but please don't talk badly of those people out there who are searching in difficult conditions.

Hello quickfingers, yes agree to disagree. In this case I really want to be proved wrong.

I don't think anyone is slagging off those who are doing the working and the clearing and examining, they are doing their jobs to the best of their ability I am sure. I also agree with those who have misgivings about the searches and the potential outcome. Lets face it, Leicestershire police and the Pj apparently worked well together in the first place, so why wouldn't all the South Wales Police and others involved not work well with the PJ. Its only when others with different motives and agendas get involved that there is, or is reported to be discontent. imo.

kathybelle wrote:He has mouthed off to the media, about dead paedophiles, burglars and cleaners, being persons of interest to him. Why are these people persons of interest to Redwood, when the McCanns are not?

It is debatable who has said what, with many thinking that Clarence has been feeding tit bits to the media. However, Andy Redwood is entitled to do TV appeals in Britain. The Portuguese can only ask for restraint (not a media blackout) when the investigation moves across to Portugal. If SY feel the need to go on camera in Britain and appeal for information and if in doing so they flag up persons of interest to them, the Portuguese have no jurisdiction over that.

And we do not know what line the SY investigation has taken regarding the McCanns. We do know that Andy Redwood embarrassed them on Crimewatch.

He cannot declare them suspects at the moment. He is not going to rely on the findings of the previous investigation no more than a physician is going to rely on an x-ray carried out by another physician when re-examining a patient who requires a second opinion.

He can scrutinise the previous findings and work outwards from that, widening the investigation out, but he cannot declare them suspects. Imagine if he did something like that. We all saw what happened when the Portuguese did it and Andy Redwood and his team could not possibly work on this without the full co-operation of everyone involved, both in Britain and in Portugal. They are trying to keep everyone onside.

And I've said it before and I'll say it again, the SY team and the PJ team are fresh officers who had nothing to do with the original investigation so that they cannot be biased one way or the other. That is how cold case reviews work. They not only lock up those who thought they had got away with it but they also free from prison those wrongly convicted. Cold case reviews are a two way street and its not just about solving the unsolved - its about looking again at supposed solved cases also where someone may be languishing in a cell for something they did not do. And that is only possible by being completely neutral from the outset.

fuzeta wrote:

pennylane wrote:Not for one second do I believe Jane Tanner spilled the beans.  This Operation Grange dig is purely for show, and a desperate attempt for them to appear kosher, having failed abysmally in their objective to gain access and control of the Portuguese investigation (imo).  

Jog on Kate and Gerry, and take your dodgy team of deaf, dumb, and blind detectives at Operation Grange with you! 

Hello Penny I am with you.  I don't suppose the people with the dogs and equipment plus the lower ranks of the British police force know this is going to be a whitewash. They are just doing the jobs they have been asked to do. That's all they know.  

Deaf, dumb and blind detectives is spot on.  See no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil.  Not about the Mc'Canns anyway.

Hi Fuzeta x

Of course many are doing a job, just as Martin Grime did his.  They have their own (private) thoughts though I'm sure.  I'll bet Mr Grime knows what the score is re this so called British investigation!

The mccanns and Murat are the only real suspects.

There are simply no others apart from maybe 'Smithman' who is unknown.

Once they had finished reading the files,which you would have hoped SY could have done in the first few months of the review, then it would have been sensible for SY to take the mccanns and tapas lot back to Portugal and deal with the multitude of inconsistencies in their statements and to get kate to answer those questions.
Off course their solicitors would advise against such questioning as it is bound to incriminate them.

I am sorry but anyone still thinking SY are playing some canny game is sadly deluded imo.

Lioned wrote:The mccanns and Murat are the only real suspects.

There are simply no others apart from maybe 'Smithman' who is unknown.

Once they had finished reading the files,which you would have hoped SY could have done in the first few months of the review, then it would have been sensible for SY to take the mccanns and tapas lot back to Portugal and deal with the multitude of inconsistencies in their statements and to get kate to answer those questions.
Off course their solicitors would advise against such questioning as it is bound to incriminate them.

I am sorry but anyone still thinking SY are playing some canny game is sadly deluded imo.

You have just answered your own question Lioned. SY could only question the McCanns and tapas friends in the way you suggest if they had their lawyers present. Kate cannot be forced to answer questions I'm afraid.

So, even if just reading the files were to suggest they should be questioned again, knowing they would probably go no comment means that other new evidence would have to be forthcoming.

Thank you LJC.I think it would be for the Portuguese to do the questioning,so what i really meant was that SY 'suggest' they return to clear up those discrepancies.
And let it be known thats a sensible move.

In other words as Cops trying to solve the case lets turn the screws and move on.

That would do for any other case but not the mccanns who are treated like they are protected dont you think ?

And there is the alarm bell !

Lioned wrote:Thank you LJC.I think it would be for the Portuguese to do the questioning,so what i really meant was that SY 'suggest' they return to clear up those discrepancies.
And let it be known thats a sensible move.

In other words as Cops trying to solve the case lets turn the screws and move on.

That would do for any other case but not the mccanns who are treated like they are protected dont you think ?

And there is the alarm bell !

I do understand where you are coming from but polite suggestions would not work either. And I doubt SY would want the Portuguese to do the questioning but perhaps a joint British and Portuguese interview as opposed to questioning would be better, but lets face it they are not going to co-operate even with a polite meeting with the Police if they think its going to incriminate them.

They may be thinking they are protected but I do not believe they are any more (if ever). Theresa May has left the Police Federation in no doubt what she thinks of their antics over Andrew Mitchell and historically over Stephen Lawrence (the Fed being the militant trade union type arm of the Police) and I think this would extend to non-members as well if she thought for one minute they were putting on a show in Portugal. None of the coppers I know are Federation members having said that but also with elected Police Commissioners having their say as well if there are any bad apples within the organisation, they will be rooted out (and there are bad apples in every organisation I can think of, including nursing, teachers, army, I could go on and on). But no other organisation is more scrutinised politically than the Police and they know and the Government knows that nothing other than a genuinely conducted re-investigation is good enough.

LJC wrote:

quickfingers wrote:The search is being carried out efficiently.   All of those people (and dogs) are not involved in any cover up and are searching to the best of their ability.      The only thing that could be controlled is the area they are searching.   They are doing everything right and let's hope they find what they are looking for.

  

I agree. What will be significant is how those higher up choose to use any evidence that may be found. That could be where the charade starts.

I do find it odd watching live images of digging. Then I wondered if its an attempt to be completely transparent. This case has been surrounded by so many accusations of cover ups, by both sides, maybe they are trying to avoid that.

Alternatively, maybe this is a site of interest but not the one of most interest. Draw attention to there, work quietly somewhere else like Huelva. Unlikely I know, but anything is possible.

A cover up is looking less likely in my opinion. All this digging and police work. And in any case if they do reach the wrong conclusion then in years to come the truth may well come out and that would refectl very badly on the police forces involved. But it's too soon to really know or even guess what is the likely outcome.

Well, the search has finally seen good results as I just heard that the among animal bones, a sock and varied vegetation, two cannabis plants were found.

Claudia79 wrote:Well, the search has finally seen good results as I just heard that the among animal bones, a sock and varied vegetation, two cannabis plants were found.

Somebody will be cursing!!   

Police Inspector: "How high are you?"

Police Sergeant: "No boss, it's 'Hi, how are you?'"

wantthetruth wrote:

Claudia79 wrote:Well, the search has finally seen good results as I just heard that the among animal bones, a sock and varied vegetation, two cannabis plants were found.

Somebody will be cursing!!   

  

almostgothic wrote:Police Inspector: "How high are you?"

Police Sergeant: "No boss, it's "Hi, how are you?"

  

Claudia79 wrote:Well, the search has finally seen good results as I just heard that the among animal bones, a sock and varied vegetation, two cannabis plants were found.

Just as I expected Claudia. I wonder what Deadwood and his mates will unearth tomorrow, if they're lucky, it might be the other sock.

Are you serious they found cannabis plants ? I been trying to grow them in my greenhouse and they just look like weeds and they can grow them over there on a bit of scrub land !

You have to remember that the 'conspirators' are powerful people so costs are irrelevant.

Andy clearly knows but few beneath him will be privy to that.

Scotland Yard and the MET have a pathetic track record at clearing up complicated crimes and its pretty certain that they can be influenced by superior beings to close cases when the need arises.

I admire those who still have some hope that all is well and every effort is going into solving the crime.Sorry but the current 'show' dont buy me at all.

Lioned wrote:Are you serious they found cannabis plants ? I been trying to grow them in my greenhouse and they just look like weeds and they can grow them over there on a bit of scrub land !

You have to remember that the 'conspirators' are powerful people so costs are irrelevant.

Andy clearly knows but few beneath him will be privy to that.

Scotland Yard and the MET have a pathetic track record at clearing up complicated crimes and its pretty certain that they can be influenced by superior beings to close cases when the need arises.

I admire those who still have some hope that all is well and every effort is going into solving the crime.Sorry but the current 'show' dont buy me at all.    

I once grew some plants, just to see if I could! They grew to be about 7 feet tall. At one point, before they were so tall, they were on the window ledge of our lounge that faces south. One afternoon, a police officer called about something suspicious in the area. He was in the dining room with his back to the door into the hall when my daughter realised that is he turned round he'd be looking straight into the lounge and directly at nine cannabis plants! She said she had to pop upstairs and closed the lounge door as she went! Phew! They got moved to my bedroom and my bed was surrounded by those things!

ETA: I was invited to a BBQ around that time at the home of a man who was a lecturer at the local university. In his garden he had plants that had grown to around 13 feet tall. They were amazing and easily seen from other gardens!

Can you buy seeds then?

AnnaEsse wrote:

Lioned wrote:Are you serious they found cannabis plants ? I been trying to grow them in my greenhouse and they just look like weeds and they can grow them over there on a bit of scrub land !

You have to remember that the 'conspirators' are powerful people so costs are irrelevant.

Andy clearly knows but few beneath him will be privy to that.

Scotland Yard and the MET have a pathetic track record at clearing up complicated crimes and its pretty certain that they can be influenced by superior beings to close cases when the need arises.

I admire those who still have some hope that all is well and every effort is going into solving the crime.Sorry but the current 'show' dont buy me at all.    

I once grew some plants, just to see if I could! They grew to be about 7 feet tall. At one point, before they were so tall, they were on the window ledge of our lounge that faces south. One afternoon, a police officer called about something suspicious in the area. He was in the dining room with his back to the door into the hall when my daughter realised that is he turned round he'd be looking straight into the lounge and directly at nine cannabis plants! She said she had to pop upstairs and closed the lounge door as she went! Phew! They got moved to my bedroom and my bed was surrounded by those things!

ETA: I was invited to a BBQ around that time at the home of a man who was a lecturer at the local university. In his garden he had plants that had grown to around 13 feet tall. They were amazing and easily seen from other gardens!

I grew some cannabis plants too. Was given the seeds by a "friend" and asked if I'd give them a go and see if they grew. I'd no idea what they were but they really took off in my greenhouse until someone pointed out what they actually were, growing in between the tomatoes and chillies, so I got my son to get rid of them for me (he probably sold them).

kathybelle wrote:

Claudia79 wrote:Well, the search has finally seen good results as I just heard that the among animal bones, a sock and varied vegetation, two cannabis plants were found.

Just as I expected Claudia. I wonder what Deadwood and his mates will unearth tomorrow, if they're lucky, it might be the other sock.

Good grief Kathy....I cant even find my odd socks, the chances off Deadwood finding the other sock in scrubland is a non starter .