Re: jo yeates - Updated:Tabak charged with murder

Loopdaloop Sun 9 Jan - 14:40

Angelique wrote:I understand that the Police are now going to take DNA from all males in the Bristol area.

I would have thought that whoever was responsible or connected would not hang around.

Angelique

yes; I read that in The Mail today as well as the fact that the police are working their way through every person who had a mobile phone signal around that area in the time which sounds promising!
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1345385/Police-urged-DNA-test-EVERY-man-Bristol-hunt-killer-Joanna-Yeates.html

So I'm guessing now that they DO have DNA evidence otherwise the DNA testing would be pointless.. So where did they get the DNA from?
They said that she was not sexually assaulted and I'm sure I read that there was nothing under her nails so surely any DNA they get is going to be pretty circumstantial at best? Unless they are going to investigate each and every bit found around her flat.

The second point is how on earth do they imagine that they are going to text 250,000 people. I'm aware in 1995 they tested a whole region but as Angelique wrote surely this sort of advice gives us an idea of who leaves the area but secondly I'm not sure I would give DNA if they were going to keep it long term as from a human rights perspective its a complete invasion of privacy. Data held by any government agency is not always safeguarded adequately is it.

**MaryB** Sun 9 Jan - 15:00

Maybe DNA from the cider bottle which somebody (unknown) had drunk out of.

**Alpine Aster** Sun 9 Jan - 16:11

Loopdaloop wrote:

So I'm guessing now that they DO have DNA evidence otherwise the DNA testing would be pointless.. So where did they get the DNA from?
They said that she was not sexually assaulted and I'm sure I read that there was nothing under her nails so surely any DNA they get is going to be pretty circumstantial at best? Unless they are going to investigate each and every bit found around her flat.

The second point is how on earth do they imagine that they are going to text 250,000 people. I'm aware in 1995 they tested a whole region but as Angelique wrote surely this sort of advice gives us an idea of who leaves the area but secondly I'm not sure I would give DNA if they were going to keep it long term as from a human rights perspective its a complete invasion of privacy. Data held by any government agency is not always safeguarded adequately is it.

The DNA could have come from even one single cell of the Perpetrator, skin, sweat saliva fibres urine, the Police must have obtained the Perpetrator's DNA if they are testing People's DNA in the Bristol Area.

The Perpetrator is not on the National Data Base then because a match would have been made and thrown up.
A Familial DNA search of the Data Base might also be done, a related technique called case specific partial match, DNA samples belonging to a Father or Son, Sister, Brother, Mother, aren't an exact match, the similarities signal a close familial Relationship.
This happened with the shoe rapist, the rapist's Sister's DNA was taken for an offence for drink driving, and this was how the rapist was finally caught the Familial DNA.

**margaret** Sun 9 Jan - 16:26

Loopdaloop wrote:

So I'm guessing now that they DO have DNA evidence otherwise the DNA testing would be pointless.. So where did they get the DNA from?
They said that she was not sexually assaulted and I'm sure I read that there was nothing under her nails so surely any DNA they get is going to be pretty circumstantial at best? Unless they are going to investigate each and every bit found around her flat.

I believe the police wouldn't have told anyone if they had so maybe just newspaper speculating? And l don't think you can murder someone and NOT have any DNA evidence on the body.....

I've yet to see anything that convinces me about the boyfriends innocence, l know the papers have said he was 'well on his way up North' but l haven't heard the police say this.

I don't think this is that complicated a case the murderer was either a stranger: so why did she let him in, why was nothing stolen, why wasn't she assaulted (horrible thing to say but murderers don't murder for nothing)? or the murderer was known to Jo: so he'll be caught soon.

Guest Sun 9 Jan - 16:27

Angelique wrote:I understand that the Police are now going to take DNA from all males in the Bristol area.

I would have thought that whoever was responsible or connected would not hang around.

Angelique

Actually no, that is not quite correct. It is the Labour MP for Bristol East, one Kerry McCarthy, who is demanding that they do that. It has obviously escaped her notice that killers are not necessarily male, or live in Bristol. It's just a sick, sad MP trying to cash in on a family's tragedy. Nothing new there, then. jo yeates - Updated:Tabak charged with murder - Page 4 477442

jo yeates - Updated:Tabak charged with murder - Page 4 477442

Guest Sun 9 Jan - 18:44

Surely the time frame will prove this correct ..or not ? Can't see her doing the 20 minute walk twice.

jejune Sun 9 Jan - 21:16

The Famous Grouse wrote:
Angelique wrote:I understand that the Police are now going to take DNA from all males in the Bristol area.

I would have thought that whoever was responsible or connected would not hang around.

Angelique

Actually no, that is not quite correct. It is the Labour MP for Bristol East, one Kerry McCarthy, who is demanding that they do that. It has obviously escaped her notice that killers are not necessarily male, or live in Bristol. It's just a sick, sad MP trying to cash in on a family's tragedy. Nothing new there, then.

I'd have thought that, as UK law currently stands, the police couldn't test any DNA without agreement. So they can check what they have, and ask males in the designated area to offer up their DNA, but they can't demand it. I agree that this is a politician trying to get their name in the 'papers, as she must know ( jo yeates - Updated:Tabak charged with murder - Page 4 36898

jo yeates - Updated:Tabak charged with murder - Page 4 36898

) that it wouldn't be allowable.

I do think, in this case, that the killer will turn out to be male, but I still believe that it will be somebody known to Jo. DNA of anyone on record as having already commited a crime isn't necessarily going to lead to anything. Thinking about it, this would also offer up some kind of information jo yeates - Updated:Tabak charged with murder - Page 4 585510

jo yeates - Updated:Tabak charged with murder - Page 4 585510

? Someone who's commited a one-off (unconvicted/unsolved) crime wouldn't have their details in the justice system, so DNA retrieved from the various crime scenes that isn't already on the computer system would suggest that the killer isn't already known to the police.

**fedrules** Mon 10 Jan - 10:35

I agree that the killer is almost certainly male.

Apparently Crimewatch are going to feature the case and Jo's Mum has volunteered to play the role of her daughter in a reconstruction, as they were similiar height and build. It made me remember the McCanns' refusal to take part in the reconstruction. There cannot be anything more traumatic than retracing your murdered daughter's last footsteps and yet this mother is willing to go through that if it can help bring her daughter's killer to justice

**wjk** Mon 10 Jan - 12:00

Exactly feds, my heart breaks for Jo's parents.

**Lioned** Mon 10 Jan - 12:38

Maybe closing in on the time of death ?

**Angelique** Mon 10 Jan - 18:00

jejune

Sorry late getting here again - I keep losing this place - I don't know where this info about DNA came from, maybe Telegraph, it was my partner who mentioned it. Will wait for his return and interrogate him!

jo yeates - Updated:Tabak charged with murder - Page 4 25346

jo yeates - Updated:Tabak charged with murder - Page 4 25346

Angelique

**Angelique** Mon 10 Jan - 18:02

Annabel wrote:Facts of Joanna Yeates murder and possible scenario

http://littlemorsals.blogspot.com/2011/01/facts-of-joanna-yeates-murder-and.html

Annabel

Thank you for this link - useful discussion going on. jo yeates - Updated:Tabak charged with murder - Page 4 25346

Angelique

**Angelique** Mon 10 Jan - 18:16

This is the link to the article in The Telegraph:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/8249039/Joanna-Yeates-murder-police-hunting-killer-might-take-DNA-from-thousands.html

By Gordon Rayner, and Richard Savill 6:55AM GMT 10 Jan 2011
As the inquiry enters its fourth week, officers are keeping open every available option as pressure mounts on them to come up with a breakthrough.
Mass DNA tests have cracked several murder cases that police had virtually given up hope of solving.
Police are understood to have obtained a DNA sample from Miss Yeates’s body that they believe could have come from her killer, and which would be compared with samples taken from men living in Bristol, where she was murdered.
Some of the city’s public figures say they support the idea of mass DNA testing, including Kerry McCarthy, Labour MP for Bristol East, and Canon Alan Finley, of Clifton Catholic Cathedral.
About 200,000 males over the age of 16 live in Bristol, but DNA testing would be likely to begin with screening of the 5,000 men living in the suburb of Clifton, where Miss Yeates lived.
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Sources at Avon and Somerset police have said DNA screening was usually considered as a last resort. It had not been ruled out as an option once other lines of inquiry had been exhausted.
One of the force’s most notorious cases of recent years, the murder of Louise Smith, 18, in 1995, was solved three years later after DNA samples were taken from 4,500 men living in her home town of Chipping Sodbury.
Miss Smith’s mother, Gillian, is also among those backing DNA testing of men in Clifton. She said: “I would hope that people in the area are tested when the police are ready to do it.”
Meanwhile, Miss Yeates’s mother, Theresa, has offered to take part in a television reconstruction of her daughter’s last-known movements.
Police are planning a reconstruction that will be aired on the BBC programme Crimewatch later this month. Theresa Yeates, 58, is keen to take on the role because she is of similar height and build to her daughter.
Speaking publicly for the first time, Miss Yeates’s brother, Chris, 28, said his sister’s death had left him in a “surreal hole of despair”. He said that since his sister’s death he, his partner Alla Ritch and her son were trying to come to terms with the loss.
Joanna Yeates’s father, David, has once again criticised the police investigation into his daughter’s murder, describing his “frustrations” with the inquiry and appearing to damn the police with faint praise. He said he was “not totally unhappy” with what they were doing.
He also made it clear that he felt the family was being kept in the dark by the police, disclosing that he found out that his daughter’s body was missing a sock – with which she may have been strangled – only when it was announced at a press conference.
A source close to the inquiry said officers on the case shared the family’s frustrations. “With any inquiry of this kind, all relevant parties would prefer there to be a very quick result with someone charged. That would be the best outcome for the family, and for everybody. But that doesn’t always happen,” he said.
Officers are still receiving information daily, and it has emerged that someone living in the same block as Miss Yeates, 25, has reported hearing a scream near midnight on the day she was last seen alive. Two other witnesses say they heard screams at 9pm.
Detectives are also trying to trace the driver of a white van seen parked on Dec 23 just yards from where Miss Yeates’s body was found two days later.
On Friday night, detectives retraced the steps Miss Yeates took as she made her way home. Police said they had several leads to follow up after speaking to more than 200 people in the Ram pub, in the streets close to her flat, and in cars near to where her body was found.
On Saturday, a book of condolence was opened in her memory at her local church."

Have asked my partner - he read it in The Sunday Telegraph.

Angelique

**Chris** Tue 11 Jan - 8:57

I would have thought the problem with large scale DNA screening is simply numbers. The male population of Bristol itself aged between 19-60 alone is upwards of 150,000 assuming the killer is local and remains in the general area.

**kitti** Tue 11 Jan - 11:57

I don't believe for one minute that the pizza cardboard and letter sent to the pub was sent by the killer.

He wouldn't dare send it for fear off DNA being found off himself on it.

They can even get dna from the saliva under the stamp, so I think it was sent by some sicko who thinks it's funny to do such a thing.

**T4two** Tue 11 Jan - 12:37

Chris wrote:I would have thought the problem with large scale DNA screening is simply numbers. The male population of Bristol itself aged between 19-60 alone is upwards of 150,000 assuming the killer is local and remains in the general area.

As you say, not a simple proposition, however observing those who either refuse to be tested or take action to avoid being tested could also be a very interesting exercise...

**fedrules** Tue 11 Jan - 15:58

Just googled another unsolved murder case from the Bristol area: Shelley Morgan disappeared in 1984 after setting off to take photos of the Avon Gorge. She had dropped off her two children at school, but, uncharacteristically, failed to pick them up later in the day. Shelley's body was found 5 months later..Her killer has never been brought to justice. She was also fair-haired and blue-eyed..like Melanie Halls and Jo Yeates. I never realised what a sinister place Bristol was..

**Chris** Tue 11 Jan - 18:09

fedrules wrote:Just googled another unsolved murder case from the Bristol area: Shelley Morgan disappeared in 1984 after setting off to take photos of the Avon Gorge. She had dropped off her two children at school, but, uncharacteristically, failed to pick them up later in the day. Shelley's body was found 5 months later..Her killer has never been brought to justice. She was also fair-haired and blue-eyed..like Melanie Halls and Jo Yeates. I never realised what a sinister place Bristol was..

I guess many areas have unsolved crimes if you delve for it. I am not sure Bristol rates that highly against some of the other metropolitan areas. Admittedly all three deaths seem to have occurred in the same general area of Bristol. I used to visit clients in the Clifton area quite often and never found it a threatening place - in fact far from it. Remember as Nick Ross used to say "don't have nightmares, do sleep well".

Guest Wed 12 Jan - 9:16

Significant find in Joanna Yeates murder hunt
8:15am Wednesday 12th January 2011

DETECTIVES investigating the murder of Jo Yeates remain tight-lipped on new evidence thought to have come to light.

It’s been reported that an item which is ‘highly significant’ to the investigation has been handed in to police as they continue to hunt the killer of the 25- year-old, who was from Hampshire.

DNA analysis and other tests are expected to be carried out on the item, which is understood not to be the sock that was missing from Jo’s body when it was discovered on Christmas Day.

A spokesperson for Avon and Somerset Police said: “We’re following up many, many lines of inquiry and we cannot go into detail about individual pieces of evidence.”

Jo’s mother, Theresa Yeates, 58, from Ampfield, has also offered to take part in a TV reconstruction of her daughter’s last movements.

Officers are planning to film the final steps of the landscape architect for the BBC’s Crimewatch programme later this month.

Her father David, 63, says his wife is keen to take on the role because she has a similar height and build to her daughter.

Jo, who went to S h e r b o r n e House School in Chandler’s Ford and Embley Park in Romsey, d i s a p p e a r e d after having C h r i s t m a s drinks at The Ram pub in Park Street, Bristol, with work colleagues.

After leaving at 8pm, she was spotted on CCTV in a Waitrose supermarket , Bargain Booze off licence and at a Tesco Express in Clifton village where she bought a pizza.

Jo’s strangled body was found by a couple walking their dogs on Christmas morning in a country lane in Failand, North Somerset – just three miles from her home.

http://www.thisishampshire.net/news/8784918.Significant_find_in_Jo_murder_hunt/

**AnnaEsse** Wed 12 Jan - 9:34

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3346001/Saliva-found-on-Jo-body.html

COPS hunting the killer of Joanna Yeates are on the verge of a breakthrough after taking a DNA sample from saliva found on her body.

A DNA profile from the sample, obtained by swabbing her skin, could hold the key to solving her murder.

Experts are working on the sample, thought to come from saliva left by the killer as he struggled to dump her.

Further tests are being carried out on other swabs taken from 25-year-old Jo's body - and from clothing and possessions in the flat in Clifton, Bristol, where she lived with boyfriend Greg Reardon, 27.

Jo was last seen on the night of December 17.

Her body was found three miles away in a ditch next to a quarry by a couple walking on Christmas Day morning. Heavy snow covering her corpse hindered obtaining a DNA profile, experts said.

But scientists were able to get one from cotton wool-style buds swiped across her body.

A huge trawl of mobile phone data is also being carried out from the nearest cell site masts to her home and the spot where she was dumped. And cops are sifting through 300 tons of rubbish.

They are looking for a Tesco pizza bought by Jo shortly before she died and a long woollen ski sock that was missing from her body when it was found.

**mumbles** Wed 12 Jan - 10:17

**fedrules** Wed 12 Jan - 11:26

The image of how the saliva came to be on poor Jo's body is very disturbing. Hopefully this sample will come from someone who's already on the police data base...

**wjk** Wed 12 Jan - 13:38

Thanks to all for keeping us up to date on this case.

**Dimsie** Wed 12 Jan - 14:51

It's good to know there seems to be a real possibility of eventually finding Jo's killer, if these latest reports are accurate. I just hope the media will respect the police's right to decide how much information about the investigation should be made public; this is something that should be left to the discretion of the police and they should be allowed to proceed with the investigation without being continually harassed by journalists. I'm all for freedom of speech and a free press, but this doesn't mean the media should be allowed to interfere in the way a criminal investigation is carried out.

I'm sure no one wants to see a repeat of the media circus that was so evident in Praia da Luz after Madeleine's disappearance, a media circus that seemed to be encouraged by her parents under the guise of 'maximum publicity'.

**MaryB** Wed 12 Jan - 23:13

I for one hope we never see the like of the McCann case again. When the parents or family of a victim of serious crime go on to achieve celebrity status. Setting up a multi million pound fund, hiring a spin doctor, even suing the policeman who tried to solve the case. That surely will remain a one off.
In the case of Jo I hope the person responsible will be brought to justice soon.

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